65 and older license exemption

[fishlessDan]

I'm just shocked at the amount of post's suggesting we take it back from our elders.I feel they do a lot to help the sport.I know they spend a lot of time, money, and effort on kids fishing derbies and such.Not to mention the many other things they do on there time and dime for the community.At least I see this going on in the small town I live in.I hope this goes on everywhere.I read a post where a fellow CDC member helped put a grandpa and his grandkids on fish.I think that is great.We need this in our sport.We need grandpa's getting them out on the water and introducing the kids to fishing.I'm pretty sure this will bring out the report about what everyone else does to support this sport and I want to thank everyone for what they do.But at the age of 16 to 65, isn't that what we should be doing?Our elders did for us.Let's not take away something we said we would gift them.I hope gift is a better word to use than entitled.I still want to say IMO I believe they earned it and are entitled to it.OK I'll shut up now.

No one wants to take anything away from them, but if the KDWP needs them to be accounted for to obtain Fed. monies to maintain the resources, then I'm all for finding a way to get a license in their hands!

[imajigger2]

Dan, thanks for the love on the age thing, but i would bet you a case of diet coke that I bought my first fishing license before you was born!!! I'm shocked you're so jaded on the politicians when you support throwin money in any amount to them without some numbers. I am working on getting the numbers but it ain't easy. I no longer hunt but to give you a small example of some waste; The WHIA program which I support has no accountability in my mind. The last year I hunted in Kansas, some of us did some research on getting to a spot to hunt. After spending some time locating a particular spot we arrived at a 160 acre field that had been harvested. It was a 160 acre soybean field that was as cleanly cut as any politicians front yard!!! I gotta feeling that wasn't a oddity. I'm still wondering who the heck that farmer knew or was related to!! Speaking of fish feeders, how come Lake Shawnee in Topeka doesn't have four or five of em, have you seen the 10 count em 10 MILLION dollar ball fields out there? How much does a fish cleaning station cost, How much does it cost to build one of them High tech fish feeders we can't afford? Why are we sourcing out mowing of the Dams to private enterprise, what would be so wrong with putting them back to native grasses and flowers that would support wildlife. A lot of our tax money is being used in this state to support a whole lot of deadbeat dads and some others sitting in jails and prisons that could be used for labor to upgrade these Parks let alone do all the mowing left after returning as many acres as we could to native flowers and grasses. I'm betting there are lots of ways to start improving without mine or any of these other folks having to buy into the blank check theory. Transparancy, Accountability, and Integrity will bring about positive change quicker than your give em a buck theory. No one can fix whats broke if we can't see the numbers and they are there we just haven't found em yet, but we will.

[Fish Taxi]

Too bad you weren't deer or goose hunting. A 160 acre field that several people must "research" in order to find would probably be a real honey hole... At least you should have saved the map and gone back the next year when it was corn or milo stubble.

I'll agree that there are a few really crappy WIHA fields out there that are Never any good. But the program itself is outstanding as a whole. For the price of a hunting license, you have access to nearly a million acres. Sorry 160 of them didn't meet your expectations...

It's a lot like the incredible bargain you get from a fishing license. Just $20 gets you access to outstanding fishing opportunities across the ENTIRE state of Kansas! What a sweet deal!:o

[kingfish387]

Hold up ya old Fart! I'm not that far behind you and I've been paying all you have for about as long as you have, Soon I'll be be paying for your depends and snotrags along with your medicare. So I'm doing my part for your retirement

As we all now know the lisence count is where the state can get the easiest and probably most amount of monies for our outdoor enjoyment. The thing to do if what most seem to think is the case, is to get the 65+ crowd verified lisences with the Fed monies to be harvested. Since you at your advanced age are wiser and more knowing than I am(by 10yrs.), I have challenge for you.Find me a REAL, HONEST politician that actually gives a crap about you, me, my kids and your grandkids that will sit down and listen to what I have to say. If you can do that, I'll round up as many outdoors folks as possible to suggest to them to provide a $5 LIFETIME license to all of the 65+ crowd so that the state will be able to get the Fed. monies and it won't break you old ENTITLED farts!

Can you pull that off?

As for the the REAL and HONEST politician.I think sometimes they are trying to please such a vast group of people it doesn't look like they care.I also believe some really just don't care.I mean look as this small group we can't really agree on the age thing.As for the 65+ license being the easiest and most monies for them to get the match.I have found it to be true the easiest way is just a temporary fix that makes the problem even harder to fix later.EXAMPLE(just about everything that our fed.gov't has done for the economy since Pres. Reagan had sat us up so well,they rode his coat tails and did nothing.When he made it clear that his plan was a 15 year plan and something would need to be done to carry it on!)Maybe they could have the 65+ just stop by every year to show I.D. and pick up a free license just to get the count.Or have a plan to grandfather in those that are near that age (say 5-10 yrs.)then do away with it.And I want it to be know I have 20 yrs. to go.Sorry I just could not shut up.I'm finding this debate really interesting and it's making me want to get more involved.Thank You all.

[imajigger2]

Well I'm not sure what page your on there Fish Taxi but i've done a little hunting in my day and it was always nice to do some research while looking fo some new spots to hunt. That area hadn't seen a milo field for the last 15 years, it just isn't in the crop rotation in that area anymore. Am very familiar with the general area just not that particular field thus the "research". I had to go back in my post to see where I said the WHIA program was no good. Couldn't find it. Only referenced that field and wondered how many more were like it which you verified as a few really crappy ones. Fact, I think WHIA programs CRP programs and anything resembling them are fantastic for Hunters and I support continued use of those programs even though I quit hunting not only because of the habitat that I encountered but because my choice of hunting is upland birds, Quail in particular. The area I am speaking of no longer supports viable quail populations thus the desire to hunt is no longer their. Facts also tell me that a few crappy ones is not something I want to spend my money on, however I support your right to do that.

[fishlessDan]

Dan, thanks for the love on the age thing, but i would bet you a case of diet coke that I bought my first fishing license before you was born!!! I'm shocked you're so jaded on the politicians when you support throwin money in any amount to them without some numbers. I am working on getting the numbers but it ain't easy. I no longer hunt but to give you a small example of some waste; The WHIA program which I support has no accountability in my mind. The last year I hunted in Kansas, some of us did some research on getting to a spot to hunt. After spending some time locating a particular spot we arrived at a 160 acre field that had been harvested. It was a 160 acre soybean field that was as cleanly cut as any politicians front yard!!! I gotta feeling that wasn't a oddity. I'm still wondering who the heck that farmer knew or was related to!! Speaking of fish feeders, how come Lake Shawnee in Topeka doesn't have four or five of em, have you seen the 10 count em 10 MILLION dollar ball fields out there? How much does a fish cleaning station cost, How much does it cost to build one of them High tech fish feeders we can't afford? Why are we sourcing out mowing of the Dams to private enterprise, what would be so wrong with putting them back to native grasses and flowers that would support wildlife. A lot of our tax money is being used in this state to support a whole lot of deadbeat dads and some others sitting in jails and prisons that could be used for labor to upgrade these Parks let alone do all the mowing left after returning as many acres as we could to native flowers and grasses. I'm betting there are lots of ways to start improving without mine or any of these other folks having to buy into the blank check theory. Transparancy, Accountability, and Integrity will bring about positive change quicker than your give em a buck theory. No one can fix whats broke if we can't see the numbers and they are there we just haven't found em yet, but we will.

Jig, your fishing dollars DID NOT go to the ball diamonds at Lake Shawnee, nor do the pay for the park maintanence at that lake. KDWP's only take over there is for the fishery and the LEO's to check for licenses.

Plain and simple, I don't feel anyone will give us all the numbers you seek, if you can get them great. I'll go over them with you.

But back to the main thing here: what I find so vexing is the fact that there is alot of Fed. monies to be had for next to nothing and youare willing to leave it the for the Fed. to give to another state or program or to just piss away instead of getting into OUR parks system for the state os KS. Why is it you are so adamant about the state of KS. not getting it?

Kingfish, jump right in! The more views and thoughts the better!

[imajigger2]

Dan you got off the page there buddy, I did not say my fishing dollars went to the ball parks, but in fairness to you i didn't specify that it was part of the entitlement money for you out of my other taxes. I'm not against the Federal monies and I haven't said that, all ive asked for is some transparancy before we condem one group or another for getting a huge free ride. The numbers are there Dan, we just haven't asked the right person yet. Hopefully that will be taken care of by next week. Maybe the transaparancy part is a little of our fault for not asking the right person or entity, However in oversight maybe that press release came out before anyone realized some viable numbers should be put out with em. it will be interesting to say the least. Am i the only guy in Kansas that ever filled out any kind of a survey card?? You know where they ask you all that personal information, Like your age??

[Fish Taxi]

Well I'm not sure what page your on there Fish Taxi but i've done a little hunting in my day and it was always nice to do some research while looking fo some new spots to hunt. That area hadn't seen a milo field for the last 15 years, it just isn't in the crop rotation in that area anymore. Am very familiar with the general area just not that particular field thus the "research". I had to go back in my post to see where I said the WHIA program was no good. Couldn't find it. Only referenced that field and wondered how many more were like it which you verified as a few really crappy ones. Fact, I think WHIA programs CRP programs and anything resembling them are fantastic for Hunters and I support continued use of those programs even though I quit hunting not only because of the habitat that I encountered but because my choice of hunting is upland birds, Quail in particular. The area I am speaking of no longer supports viable quail populations thus the desire to hunt is no longer their. Facts also tell me that a few crappy ones is not something I want to spend my money on, however I support your right to do that.

I thought you meant that the entire WIHA program was an "example of government waste", but you just meant a very small portion of it. We're on the same page now.

If hunters take the time to report the consistently crappy WIHAs, they can be removed from the program or the landowner can receive a reduced payment or even no payment if the fields are bad enough, or it appears that the fields have been deliberately altered to keep away hunters. We just have to do our part and report the bad ones. But I honestly haven't ever seen one that was so bad I would call it in. The ones that I call "crappy" would be more appropriately called "always marginal". But even those serve a purpose. They are usually close to a big town, and they get used a lot more than you might think.

Anyway, it all seems to boil down to whether or not you believe that KDWP(T) is filled with good, honest people who are doing the best they can with what they have, or you believe that they are a bunch of greedy fat cats. I believe they are good folks, and do the best they can for us. Some on here obviously don't. I agree that they need to be held accountable for their spending, but I suspect that our license fees are currently put to good use. I certainly wouldn't point at one bad WIHA field from ??? years ago and say, "KDWP can't be trusted!"

I think they should have transparency, as you suggested. And they should be held accountable for their spending, as you suggested. But I also think that they are providing a tremendous service to all of us who love the outdoors. And yes, I do "trust" them. When they make an announcement that says something logical like, "we can't afford the loss of license sales to the baby boomer generation because they make up a huge proportion of our license sales", I believe that they are telling the truth. It is consistent with what they have been telling us all along, which is that X and Y aren't buying fishing licenses. I believe that's true too.

[imajigger2]

I agree with most of what you say. I want to see the supporting facts that the baby boomers are the problem here is all. I'm a believer that you cannot just throw out an idea that is a problem without supporting facts. No household, no business and no Governemnt would be operating as effieciently as they should without fact supporting those ideas. Until we can identify problem areas by supporting facts we cannot fix something that is broken. You nor I would have our boat mechanic put a new powerhead on our boatmotors without some supporting documentation would we? Every day of our lives we make decisions on how best to operate, we do it with supporting facts. Lets see how many on here want to give up some facts and I'll start it off.


I purchase fishing licenses for three adults each year. One for me, one for the better half and one for an adult daughter.
I know two over 65's that got a free license last year. I probably know more on here but not sure cause I haven't asked them if they buy or get one free.
I take way more under 16 people (grandkids) one who lives with us permanantly fishing each year than I do over 65's, guessing about three to one.
I purchase a fishing license on average for two other states each year.
I purchase a deer license on average of about once every three years for Kansas, no one at my house likes to eat them.
I purchase a Nebraska hunting license because I love quail hunting and the opportunities are better there for me.
I purchase a Federal pass for the ramps each year.
I purchase at least three sometimes four State Park Stickers for different states each year.
I purchase at least three and sometimes four Kansas state park stickers at full price each year, three of them are for my vehicles.
I register my boat here in Kansas.

I will go out on a limb here with this unpopular statement. I'm betting that under 16 license users are the largest group. Lets start charging them the same year we do everyone else, so we can get the coveted Federal dollars for vast improvements. Why would any true lover of the sport object to this? What social right do they hold over the 65 and over crowd to deserve an exemption?

[fishlessDan]

I will go out on a limb here with this unpopular statement. I'm betting that under 16 license users are the largest group. Lets start charging them the same year we do everyone else, so we can get the coveted Federal dollars for vast improvements. Why would any true lover of the sport object to this? What social right do they hold over the 65 and over crowd to deserve an exemption?[/QUOTE]

I'll take that bet! It wouldn't be close!

If all the baby boomers had the foresight to buy a LIFETIME license 15yrs. ago this wouldn't even be a debate!