CJ WATER TEMPS AND FISHING THREAD!

[INTIMIDATOR]

That brings up something I've always wondered about. I am not an intelligent fisherman and I've always wondered about "matching the hatch". If you're "matching the hatch" why would a fish bite your bait when the real thing is all around it?

That's part of the fun....when you know that the fish are full, or they have all of that "Fresh Sushi" all around them, and then you have to figure out a way to get them to bite...so you have to make them react to a lure by pissing them off and making it irritate them so they'll try to kill it, or try to make them eat it!
That's when, IMHO, you are a true fisherman...when you can make that lure look like "EASY PICKIN'S", by twitching, stopping/starting, death fall, etc...they are opportunistic, they will not, no matter what, pass up a easy meal that they don't have to expend alot of energy on...we've all seen fish come up puking food, or have food in their mouth waiting on something else to digest.
Sometimes to overcome all the natural baitfish around them, you can put on a gawdy color with different action and torment them. At different times, Bright colors catch their attention and are easier for them to see....but then again, somedays, according to the light, etc, they want natural looking and acting lures, that are easier to catch.
The COLOR PAPERS in the beginning of the CJ thread help explain some of this also.

That's why I spend so much time with trying different stuff, just to see if it will work in different conditions....I also think that after all this time I have been experimenting, I have just touched the tip of the iceberg! There are still plenty of days that I go home perplexed, and I know it was my fault and something that I missed...but not as many as 5 years ago!
I may not have all the answers before I die, but Dale is sure going to have all the knowledge that I have gained from all of this...Hopefully he starts fishing again when he's older, so he can use it!!!lol

[Shaggi]

That's part of the fun....when you know that the fish are full, or they have all of that "Fresh Sushi" all around them, and then you have to figure out a way to get them to bite...so you have to make them react to a lure by pissing them off and making it irritate them so they'll try to kill it, or try to make them eat it!
That's when, IMHO, you are a true fisherman...when you can make that lure look like "EASY PICKIN'S", by twitching, stopping/starting, death fall, etc...they are opportunistic, they will not, no matter what, pass up a easy meal that they don't have to expend alot of energy on...we've all seen fish come up puking food, or have food in their mouth waiting on something else to digest.
Sometimes to overcome all the natural baitfish around them, you can put on a gawdy color with different action and torment them. At different times, Bright colors catch their attention and are easier for them to see....but then again, somedays, according to the light, etc, they want natural looking and acting lures, that are easier to catch.
The COLOR PAPERS in the beginning of the CJ thread help explain some of this also.

That's why I spend so much time with trying different stuff, just to see if it will work in different conditions....I also think that after all this time I have been experimenting, I have just touched the tip of the iceberg! There are still plenty of days that I go home perplexed, and I know it was my fault and something that I missed...but not as many as 5 years ago!
I may not have all the answers before I die, but Dale is sure going to have all the knowledge that I have gained from all of this...Hopefully he starts fishing again when he's older, so he can use it!!!lol

In my mind, which I think is too focused on common sense, what you said there makes sense but it doesn't address the common thought of "matching the hatch". What your saying is "be different". No baitfish is going to swim around nonchalantly when a predator is nearby but you can make your offering more enticing than the real thing. I guess the next time I see "match the hatch" on a forum I'll just ask the poster what he means.

[INTIMIDATOR]

In my mind, which I think is too focused on common sense, what you said there makes sense but it doesn't address the common thought of "matching the hatch". What your saying is "be different". No baitfish is going to swim around nonchalantly when a predator is nearby but you can make your offering more enticing than the real thing. I guess the next time I see "match the hatch" on a forum I'll just ask the poster what he means.

The common thought of MATCHING THE HATCH is just that....basically, if fish are eating shad, you throw a shad colored, same sized, shaped bait....if they are eating craws, mayflies, minnows, worms, or other insects or baitfish, that is what you try to copy. I ONLY DO THIS WHEN THEY ARE TOTALLY KEYED IN ON A CERTAIN KIND OF FOOD AND WILL TAKE NOTHING ELSE!
This is easier to do early in the year before the spawns and the HUGE amount of fry from the past spawn are eating size....this is when the fish gorge and you have to do different things.
When the mayfly larva are shedding is when I use the bluegill color because of the iridescent blues, gold, etc....in the Spring before and during the spawn is when smoke silver glitter like a minnows is excellent...with heavy rains, a worm color like dark pumpkin or black leech color works....on and on!
That's why you always look around and see what's going on in the lake and keep notes.
When I match the hatch, I still try to make my offering different to improve the chances of a strike.

[Shaggi]

The common thought of MATCHING THE HATCH is just that....basically, if fish are eating shad, you throw a shad colored, same sized, shaped bait....if they are eating craws, mayflies, minnows, worms, or other insects or baitfish, that is what you try to copy. I ONLY DO THIS WHEN THEY ARE TOTALLY KEYED IN ON A CERTAIN KIND OF FOOD AND WILL TAKE NOTHING ELSE!
This is easier to do early in the year before the spawns and the HUGE amount of fry from the past spawn are eating size....this is when the fish gorge and you have to do different things.
When the mayfly larva are shedding is when I use the bluegill color because of the iridescent blues, gold, etc....in the Spring before and during the spawn is when smoke silver glitter like a minnows is excellent...with heavy rains, a worm color like dark pumpkin or black leech color works....on and on!
That's why you always look around and see what's going on in the lake and keep notes.
When I match the hatch, I still try to make my offering different to improve the chances of a strike.

I think I'll just put a worm under a bobber. It's a lot less stressful. LOL So what are you thinking now about the Crazy Flappers? Swimmers still going to be your first choice and use the Crazy Flappers to stir things up or perhaps use them more in specific situations like around the rip rap? Have you tried them in the water yet? With the wider body I'm wondering if they might turn on their side or go into a spin especially if the hook isn't put in perfectly straight. Although the Keitech video doesn't hint of a problem. Ahhh...so much to learn and so little time.

[INTIMIDATOR]

See Shag, you're looking at it the wrong way...if I had to put live-bait under a bobber, troll, long-line, spider rig, etc, any way in which you are not controlling the bait yourself, I WOULD QUIT!
I have a blast trying to figure out the entire process, fooling a fish into reacting, and biting a hunk of plastic.

Yep, swimbaits are always first...I'll use the 3 types if I have to, then switch to the flapper...I'm thinking it'll really come in to play when the Fresh Water Lobsters peek their heads out from the rocks in the Spring.
I used the Flapper at CJ for about 5 minutes, it had me excited...it won't turn over, and it swims great, it has the Keitech double silicon with the heaviest on the bottom so it always swims perfectly.
Like I said, I loved the Dahlberg Craw, but it was limited in it's action, this one has all new possibilities! We have plenty of time to learn and play!!!

[Lowellhturner]

Guys the Buck Creek Marina concession was just put up for bid. Am looking for an interested long term business partner...

[INTIMIDATOR]

Had a report today that someone fell through the ice and died today...this is unconfirmed right now...I went out and there were no signs of this.
PLEASE BE CAREFUL OUT THERE!
Here's some sad pics for those of us that only like "liquid water"!
Hopes for a early Spring!

[Lowellhturner]

Have your `cat`s claws` (ice claws) ON your person, preferably either tied to your wrists and tucked up your sleeves or tied onto a cord and draped over your neck ready for INSTANT use if necessary ! Also have a 50` length of light STRONG rope, clothes line ect WITH you, NOT left 1/2 mile away in your vehicle where it`s next to useless if you have to run to get it and then run back in case of an emergency. Consider having those cat`s claws and that light rope as LIFE INSURANCE ! This is especially true with new ice ! AVOID ice fishing alone if possible, take your cell phone with you, and stay well away from `heaves` and buckled ice like the plague; even older supposedly refrozen `heaves` can further shift weakening the surrounding ice even more. BE SAFE ! NO fish or amount of fish is worth your life !

[crappiemax]

...if I had to put live-bait under a bobber, troll, long-line, spider rig, etc, any way in which you are not controlling the bait yourself, I WOULD QUIT!
I have a blast trying to figure out the entire process, fooling a fish into reacting, and biting a hunk of plastic.

but you are controlling the bait using those methods. There certainly is a lot more to fishing than just throwing a swimbait.

[INTIMIDATOR]

but you are controlling the bait using those methods. There certainly is a lot more to fishing than just throwing a swimbait.

I said that "I" would quit....everyone that knows me, knows that i cannot sit or be bored, and that I want to control as much as my fishing as possible...Let me explain, and remember, this IMHO!

There are no wrong ways to catch fish if you enjoy it, some of us have taken things way past the point of a normal person that is sitting down in a chair or boat and relaxing while fishing...I need way more of a challenge to keep me busy and my mind occupied!
Believe it or not, but the number of people who think like me are growing...fishing for us takes on more of a spiritual, wanting to learn and understand, and then use your wits, to trick a fish to react to your lure. Some, take it even further by making their own special lures...at one time I "Frankensteined" lures to make what I needed...now I've found the perfect line to suit my purpose, so I can spent time researching and learning.
The Japanese and their fishing companies are so far ahead of most US fishing companies, because they take fishing to almost a level of Religion, and spare no expense to engineer and create lures that work in their HEAVILY PRESSURED waters, instead of just using cheap material, trying to mass produce, and make a buck!

You are right, a person has alittle more control while bobber fishing with artificials, those with live bait not so much, except depth and maybe some sensitivity! One of the best anglers I have seen for a specific species is "Grandma Bluegill"...she has her system down to a art form...she's an 87 year old woman loves bluegills, her husband is house bound and she catches food for them...she has a super sensitive rig and uses her jigs tipped with a different larva than others use...she never sits, she moves that lure in different ways in her areas and leaves almost every day with a mess of fine 'gills....she climbs the rocks still and it keeps her young...Most other 'gill hunters are able to only catch small 'gills....why? Because there's more to it, and they are missing something that she has figured out!

Basically Trolling, Long-line fishing, and Spider rigging were all developed for fishermen to cover large areas of water, locate fish, and to catch as many fish as possible...this was mainly helpful to PROS who did not know a lake well or didn't want to spend alot of time fishing it and figuring it out, or guides and Charters who needed to catch alot of fish for their customers. It caught on with regular fishermen for the same reasons. Most of your controll of the baits comes from boat speed, weight of the lure/etc, and action of the lure....and you sit back and watch for bites!
Some Trolling is needed for Species Specific fishing like Catfishing, to get the bait to move the way it is needed to entice the kitties...I go out with Doc to learn things he can teach and then put it in memory in case it is ever needed, or can be incorporated into the way I fish. I fish with guys who vertical jig, I watch them and ask questions, I watch how their baits move, the float, the flutter....but I throw a swimbait and incorporate ideas from them to improve my way of fishing! I fish with drifters...I fish with others who fish sorta like me Rusty, Jeff, Don, Daniel, Joe, etc, and pick stuff up from them...I spend alot of time picking other people's brains....there are people who know CJ just as well as I do and some even better and we all talk....knowledge like this can be used anywhere!

IMHO, throwing a swimbait is one of the purest forms of fishing, if you can perfect it! A predator fish eats fish, it's that basic!
But, if you just throw it out and crank it back, you might as well troll the swimbait behind a boat...yep, you will catch fish, but you miss out on everything else that goes into it.
I try to fully understand the fishery, I can tell you when the Craws come out, when larva is hatching, what baitfish are being eaten, and use this to my advantage. I also have full control of the swimbait, I can make it have nomal action, change the action, and make it do what I want, or act how I want. I control speed, depth, action, and the way it looks...I can bounce it across the bottom like a craw or worm, make it flutter, die, act wounded, run it on the surface, etc...whatever is needed!
My system was developed to be efficient, normally I carry a plastic pocket pack of the baits I need, jig heads, and chartreuse niblets...and the same rod and reel with braid...I do this on a boat, from shore, or hiking and fishing, or at other lakes....I fish for Crappie, Walleye, Smallmouth, Largemouth, and White Bass, the same exact way....you can also use this for Perch, Cats, Stripers, Pike, Muskie, Peacock Bass, Snakehead, etc, and different Ocean fish...with a Tackle change and different bait size.
The swimbaits I use have 3 styles and different sizes, I can Match the hatch, with body style or color, or go Big and Bright when needed, based on knowledge.
To me it's not so much about catching fish, but the process involved, and I like to be able to control as much as the process as possible...to do that you need the extra knowledge of the Species you are after, the patterns of the species, the temps and weather that affect the patterns, water temps, the way the lake will react, how light in the water affects lures, etc, etc....I can catch Crappie with this style from ice out until the water hits 39 degrees again, and Walleye until ice forms...and then I normally stop fishing due to the cold and having to sit and barely move my swimbait to get bites, which would require a bobber, vertical fish, or ice fish, which isn't going to happen! I fill 2 freezers every year with Crappie and Walleye in the Spring and catch and release all summer and fall until the water cools...I release Big fish to Spawn, I help the local fisheries as much as possible, along with helping others!

And yes, sometimes I don't catch the amount that I think I should...and this is due to ME making a mistake and missing something...but normally I think about it and figure it out, to be used the next time it happens...but that is happening less and less!
So yes, you are right...there is certainly more than just throwing a swimbait or towing it behind a boat...and I understand!

Good Fishing To You!
Brent