Any Bush Supporters Out There In Crappie Land?

With so many people bashing Bush at every available opportunity, I have one question. Does anyone support Bush on this board at all? I am behind the man and if he could run again, I'd vote for him. It seems all I read on the off topic board is people bashing him at every available chance they get. And, being a free country, it is their right. However, I stand behind him and think that he is doing a good job and leading this country in the right direction. I also believe that there are alot more people like me who believe what I do on this board who either feel intimidated or just plain don't want to speak about their politics. Which is fine also.

I also thank God that he is in office to nominate the next two Supreme Court Justices. I could not imagine who would be nominated had Gore or Kerry won. Although, I could definately see a Ruth Bader Ginsburg type coming out of either of those two camps.

If the majority disagrees, then get out there and vote in 3 more years. We'll see if this country wants Hillary or the alternative to Hillary.

Just had to say my peace and put my support out there for MY PRESIDENT. Thanks for lending your eyes to my post. :D

Georga has had more things thrown at him since he's been President since Roosevelt. I think he's the right man for the right time. I heard on the news today that only about 19% of the people don't support Bush. ANd it has always been the same people.

ANd of course the mainstream Media doesn't like him. Bashing him every chance they get. I hate to think what ti would be like if Hillary was in there. Now I've had my say.

He's the best boss I've ever had...Aim High.

I still support im also. I couldn't imagine this country with a Gore or Kerry in office right now.

I voted for him and am not ashamed of it. It's a constant source of amazement to me that folks are so quick to jump on the bashing bandwagon. One of the very basic facts that so many people choose to ignore is that NO president has complete autonomy. As we learned in high school social studies and history classes, there are very few decisions made by the presidently singlehandedly. (At least that was what I was taught 20+ years ago).

So there you go -- my opinion presented, in a nutshell. If anybody disagrees, that's cool. Just try not to call me an idiot or a moron or tell me how stupid I am . . . . because it's rude. )

In a time like this, he needs the peoples support, not their negative comments. People need to focus on the crisis at hand and support the effort instead of using this tragedy for political gain. I am not Pro Bush, but I am not Anti Bush either. I dont agree with everything he does, but I dont dissagree with everything he does either. Nobody is perfect, not even the president, this is a learning experience for everyone. People should stop pointing fingers and playing the blame game.

The main problem with the present administration is that there is no accountability. With the Republican Congress and Senate. No one wants to challenge him or they will disappear like everyone that has challenged his authority. His Science advisory's head is on the block now because he wouldn't back Bush on Intelligent Design theory. He has surrounded himself with his buddy's that are incompetent at the positions they hold. Micheal Brown is a good example.

I don’t like talking politics, mainly because it turns into a name calling contest. But I voted for Bush both times and if I had it to do again I would again, assuming he running against the same people. I tend to agree with J White I vote for the person not the party. Do I agree with all Bush is doing, no I don’t, but the funny thing is, my biggest concern even the Bush bashers don’t talk about and that is the Illegal immigration problem. I’m afraid that is where the next terrorist will get in to this country. Before someone says I’m a raciest and just don’t like Hispanics, I have no problem with immigrants I just think that we should make sure there check out before we let them in the country. I do believe that he has had more problems thrown at him as a president than most other presidents, and in general he has done well with those. Now I’m going to try keeping a read only attitude on the rest of the political threads, I don’t want to get to calling someone names or be called one.

I voted for him. I am a registered Republican. I think here soon, I'm changing to the Independent Party. I think George Bush needs to be impeached for his immigration policy. Our borders are wide open. Do you know how many...OTM's...Other than Mexicans..come across our borders everyday? They come from all over the world, through the desert and right into the US. Our military needs to be on the borders. I do not mind people coming in, its just that I'd like to know who they are.

As for the Democratic spokespersons, I love it. The Democratic party is imploding. They are getting more shrill by the week. Sadness is they are dragging some good democratic politicians to the left with them; and they go willfully for the sake of the party. They stand for nothing other than abortion on demand,gay marriage and high taxes. They have not a clue as to why they lost the house, senate,white house, and most governorships.

However, when one gets to the position of power in the house,senate, and white house, you are fairly corrupt.

It would not matter who was in the oval office. A lot of bashing would still go on and on and on. I did vote for Bush both times and I am not ashamed of it. I also voted for Bill Clinton both times and I am not ashamed of that either. If Bill could run again, I would vote for him in a New York second. Fact is, the more some one is in the public eye, there will be some one out there that will hate them no matter who they are.
My 2 cents worth.

Indeed he is the right man for the white house. Just wish we could re-elect him again.
Maybe his wife will run.

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Originally Posted by Eager Beaver

The main problem with the present administration is that there is no accountability. With the Republican Congress and Senate. No one wants to challenge him or they will disappear like everyone that has challenged his authority. His Science advisory's head is on the block now because he wouldn't back Bush on Intelligent Design theory. He has surrounded himself with his buddy's that are incompetent at the positions they hold. Micheal Brown is a good example.

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And just how is this Bush's fault? He did not elect the Congress and Senate......WE DID. Talk about no accountability? Look at the past adminsitration then talk about accountability.

Glen, you would have to read some of the beavers posts to begin to understand his thinking. As an American, he has a right to his opinion.

I support Bush on everything but the Mexican Border. The influx of cheap labor hurts my family and my chance of working on a consistant basis. The pollsters know who they are polling and choose to poll the ones they think will go the way they want them to. News itself is for sale as much as anything else. ie.. Don Henley, Dirty Laundry.

I don't usually get involved in these political discussions due to the fact that I've seen so many of them turn into a name calling personal attack between guys that got along well until politics came between them. I've always voted for the man and not the party. As 1weezer just asserted, he voted for Bill Clinton, just as I did, as a measure to eliminate the other runner for the same office, and I'm a staunch RNC member. To have voted for anyone else at that time would have been insanity, IMHO. I voted for Bush too, as much for blocking the remainder of the field as for Bush himself. I approve some of what Bush has done and probably disapprove more of what he hasn't done or has done wrong. In any case, as in the Clinton race, I voted for the man I considered the best choice, in my opinion there were no alternatives. You can rest assured I will alienate no one due to political affliation, nor will I engage in a verbal attack or stand by while others do. We are here because we all like to fish for our favorite, the crappie. Lets not degrade the best fishing forum on the web by personal attacts. That is the one thing our Administrator asks and little else. Just a reminder, guys. Not too much to ask, is it?

I voted for President Bush both times and his father when he ran. I support my President no matter who he is. I didn't vote for Clinton and never would for any reason or any political office, but he was my President voted in by my fellow Americans and I supported him. I despised him, but had I met him I would have called him "Mr. President; Sir". That doesn't mean that I agree with everything that any President has done or said since 1977 when I started voting, but if we put them there, then we need to hold ourselves accountable to an extent. If none of us made mistakes, we'd all be perfect. They're human, but their office requires our respect and support. A nation divided within itself, cannot stand. PLEASE let's not let this get out of hand like the discussion last week! We all need to stick together for the troops, hurricane evacuees, our children, our government, and ourselves. Backwood thoughts from an AMERICAN to other AMERICANS!

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Originally Posted by Crappie Reaper

Glen, you would have to read some of the beavers posts to begin to understand his thinking. As an American, he has a right to his opinion.

I support Bush on everything but the Mexican Border. The influx of cheap labor hurts my family and my chance of working on a consistant basis. The pollsters know who they are polling and choose to poll the ones they think will go the way they want them to. News itself is for sale as much as anything else. ie.. Don Henley, Dirty Laundry.

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I agree with you that something has to be done about our boarders. I do not think they should be closed. This country was founded by imagrents. But they should come in the legal way.

If you want the immigrants to stop coming across the boarder that is very easy to solve. Washington should tell Mexico to stop their people from coming across the boarder illegally or we put santions against Mexico. Hit them hard in the pocket book. It should be up to them to keep their people on their side of the boarder not America. Mexico is getting rich off of the US allowing them to be here, and now this administration wants to make them legal citizens.

Mexicans should be allowed to come here, legally. They are doing jobs lazy white and blacks won't do, in general. When we start paying 10 dollars for a 15 strawberries,and other fruits, we'll be raising heck. Most of them are hard working people. Can you realize how much some things would be if it were not for their cheap labor?

It does piss me off that America is the only country in the world without a national language.

Nothing like polotics to get everyone going! I voted for George Bush and still support him. But I guess I would support whoever our President was, especially in tough times. As far as the war, I have 3 very good friends who all served in Iraq. I value their opinions more than any newscast or political person. All 3 said that the majority of people there are thankful that we are there. All 3 also said they would go back, and one of them did for a second tour.

Weezur, I didn't even know they would let you vote!!!!!!!!!!!

Russ

Ok fishing pox, I DO realized how CHEAP certain things are from the illegals being in this country. I agree there are plenty of lazy Americans. But, when one has to literally work their azz off everday, and not make much for their effort, it's easy to be turned away from the work that is available. I think your statement is a copout and if the illegals were not here, there would be someone that would gladly do their job, but it would cost the business owner a bit more (i.e. ins, possible health, etc.). The business owner caught using them should be fined so much, they would have to think twice about having a proper I-9 form on hand for their employees.

This is the first post you have made, that I am sorry, I cannot agree with. Why shouldn't a person, an American, be concerned about the wage paid for his chosen trade? Too bad if veggies and building costs were to have increases due to the workers getting paid for an honest days work. As a Trim Carpenter, they have stagnated, and in most cases reversed the amount each job will pay. I am making less now than I was 15 years ago. I am from the "old school" and take the extra time to make sure a job is done right. I cannot afford an experienced American helper. I should be able to employ other experienced Carpenters @ $15-20 an hour (They deserve a living too). But, because of the influx of illegals, labor stays at a bare minimum. I am down to two builders that will pay the extra .15 a foot that I charge above the illegals because of the quality of detail. And the wage I charge, hasn't changed in 15 years.

I don't know what you do for a living, but, fantasize a group of illegals flooding your market in your chosen work. Then picture the competition getting tougher and tougher price wise. Then, think of what it would be like to possibly, completly lose your job to an illegal. What you have mentioned, is how the upper echelon thinks and does not try to put themselves in someone elses place. They only look at it as keeping prices down for them. I promise you, the cost of residential, or commercial building has only risen in matterials only. The labor on most trades has remained, or been lowered for years now. Most residential builders only profits 3-4k on a small 2-3 bedroom home. The insurance, the fees, the materials have all risen. The price of labor has gone down.

Now there was a time, they did mainly the meanial jobs. But, watch your back. Now their children are gaining education, and your job, or your childrens job, could be next.

The illegals are now able to get home mortgages from American banks. All they need is an ID card, no visa, no passport. I don't blame them at all for wanting a better life. But it does affect my familys income severely. There are so many in the country right now, if we sent them all home, and sealed the borders, it would cause an economic domino effect dissaster.

I have no problem at all with legal immigrants. After all, that is the way of the USA. But, we must seal the borders and at least know who and why someone is here. It's for the TOTAL good.

This is Reapers opinion.

Put the shoe on the other foot and think about it. The government for years has thought the same way as you. I personaly think of it just like a cancer, once it gets started, it grows and grows. And eventually kills the host.

I have to agree with fishingpox somewhat on this one. I have worked with some Mexican people before, and for the most part they are very hard workers. Like he said, they will do jobs for minimum wage that you coldnt pay some people twice the amount to do it. Also, I understand your concern crappie reaper, in some situations it hurts people like you. If you think about most jobs like factories and such, why do you think they are moving work to other countries, for cheaper labor. Some companies will not pay higher wages, they will just move. Why not let some of those folks work here and keep those jobs here, it does leave room for some jobs for the rest of us and it does help the economy. If they leave the country, it's a total negative. I do agree with you reaper that they should come here legally. I dissagree with our government giving them all these tax breaks and free health care that we Americans cant get. They seem to be able to buy up all the gas stations.

i'm not a bush supporter and not ashamed. i'm not happy with the direction that our country is heading. i don't consider myself a bleeding heart liberal, but i'm don't agree with the ultra conservative view of the president. i feel that we, as a country, are losing important social services that are needed to sustain the populations of our country. i saw the same thing when bush sr. was in office. i don't like that our country is in debt. i don't like that our young men and women are being killed everyday for .... well i don't know why they are there cuz everytime bush has to support the reason why our service over there it's a different reason. i don't like how the families of our service men and women in the states are on welfare (oh, but the budget been's cut cuz people on welfare are lazy and no good...i forgot. [sarcasm] and have lost their partner's work benefits. it's not fair. those people are over there dying.....for me...some say...and their familie are not being cared for. our soldiers, marines, and sailors are being forced to use substandard equipment


i have to stop. it's makes me so upset. there's so much...but like someone mentioned above, and i thought it was funny, i have been quiet cuz i believe in our country. i believe that everyone has a right to their own opinion, but i have been confronted by bush supporters or conservative republicans in a very negative manner that i just keep my mouth shut cuz i don't want to put up with it.

i'm like a lot of you though....i didn't vote for bush, but i didn't vote for gore or kerry. i ddin't feel that either one would have made a good president. the first time around i didn't vote for anyone for president cuz i didn't like any of them. the second time around i voted for the independent candidate so my vote wasn't wasted.

look, abortion is an important issue. family values is an important issue. but these issues don't run our country. i feel that polititians are just pulling at our heart strings to get in office but they really don't have a plan of action. i don't vote for a candidate based on those issues. i vote for someone that has a plan to get this country out of debt. a candidate that has a plan for the support of our infrastructure, jobless rates, poverty, security, and international relations. that's what's is important...at least according to me.

They work for less than minimum wage at times. And I never said they did not work hard. You missed my point completely. They ARE hurting the economy. Is it because they allow you to purchase items cheaper? You may as well be sending your money to china or taiwan, cause regardless, it still leaves the country, to bring over other family members. I pray that they never infect your career with their willing to work for nothing, pay no taxes, and pay into social security at times to never draw a thing. Yes, that happens. It is one reason why our Government refuses to do anything about the illegals. Some of them do pay in, but never withdraw.

Why does it always have to be about the almighty $$$?

"why does it always have to be about the $$$$"

i'm with your reaper.

Crappie Reaper, nobody said you said they did not work hard. We just stated that they did. They are no more hurting our economy than all those lazy ass Americans out there that are too lazy too work. Thats why you see alot of welfare people and all in New Orleans and many other places. I dont blame them for coming over here and wanting to better themselves. Alot of people over here dont want too, they want everything handed to them. I agree with you about the fact that they should do it legally. The more it cost to make things, the more they will sell it for. People are in business to make money, so if its costing them more to produce it, then it will cost you more to buy it. I will tell you what I've witnessed many times. I have worked with people on some jobs that would lay out of work alot, you ask them why they missed and they say. I cant make over a certian amount or I cant get my government check and my food stamps. Now these companies have to call in people and pay them time and a half if they can get someone to come in. It hurts the rest of us when this happens. The legal immigrants I've worked with didnt seem to have this problem. These companies are not aloud to just fire these people, it's just not that easy. Even when it does reach that point, it cost them again to train new workers. Crappie Reaper, you have got me and fishing pox all wrong. Go back and read. There is nowhere we said that illegals should be here. fishing pox even mentioned an impeachment of the president due to the border control. We are just saying there is nothing wrong with them being here legally doing the jobs that others wont do. Crappiefishergirl, you are totally right about the candidates not having a plan, they use personal issues like you mentioned to get the top seat, then they dont have a clue how to run a country. I'm with you on that one. Although I dont agree with abortion, thats not what I would base my vote on either.

I as well do not have a problem at all with those that are in the US legally. I am just stating that the # of illegals has spread nationwide, and in my opinion is an infection to our economy. And if it persists, I too will end up in the welfare line. I will not have much choice. I stand strong in my statement that allowing it to go on, makes things worse for all. And, why would you mind paying a bit more for anything, Made in America, by Americans? It sounds as if you are using the same frame of thought that the rich use in by justifying their presence. The law is the law, imigration laws should be followed as much as robbery, drug trafficking, murder, etc.

I agree with you and fishingpox on many, many points. But, the attitude that their cheap labor justs keeps certain prices down is not good in my humble opinion. Hell, we might as well stop buying anything Made in America. Let's send all out business out of the country and act like the major manufacturers that have laid off thousands to move their operation out of the US. Stop buying Fords, Chevys, Chrysler products. Get them real nice "China tools". Maybe we should just invade Mexico and let their people do the work, and we can all head south to retire under the sun. The illegals are a cancer to our economy. There are so many of them in the US now, that if we did send them back, it would be detrimental to the present economy. I just know they cost me money, and every American money to support them, doctor them, school them. Whether you realize it or not, they too collect food stamps, section 8 help on rent, and there is not a thing we can do about it. Keep the legal aliens, YES. Get rid of the trash, hell yes. I feel that some people are still not understanding the point I am trying to make about illegals. Frankly, I give up trying. I know it effects us all and is not saving us squat.

I agree with you about the illegals. You know what irks me most of all. You cant even hardly buy an American flag thats even made in America anymore. When 9/11 took place and during the Iraq war, you couldnt hardly buy an American flag, everyone was sold out. They were burning them by the thousands in the other countries. I passed on buying my own countries flag because it was made in another country.

There is a big W on my windshield and I would say he was the best boss I every had but I was in when President Reagan was president....don't get me wrong I don't agree with the stance of immigration, taxation (too much) or the spending frenzy on non-military social programs. But he is the Right man for the job.
Semper Fi

Agreed fishboy, best man for the job for the choices we had. Bush has the ballz to do what needs done.

Mr. Reaper, when I was a younger man, I used to do cornice work. I took 5 years of building trades in junior and senior high schools. I graduated school and went to work as a carpenter,then worked my way to cornice work. I liked it and as a matter of fact was pretty good at it. Then I noticed all the mexican workers coming in. Now this was back in 1977. I could not believe my eyes, they were like ants coming into the construction field. So, I left the business. I'm just glad I was young enough to go find another profession. I got lucky enough to find a job helping a man who owned an electrical company. Also,he had a small shop where he rebuilt and rewound electrical motors. The electric motors caught my interest and I have been doing that since. No, I do not have to worry about someone taking my job at a lower wage. I'm not saying everyone can make the move as I did to find another job. Heck, here I am 47 years old going to college at night,to hopefully obtaining an electrical engineering degree. My threat is not cheap labor but a fat,beergut,rotten tooth redneck of a boss who told me what the F are you going to school for,your degree is not going to do me any good. Pisses him off because he knows I'm on my way out of the business and not making his living anymore. I can't wait to see how he replaces 27 years of experience in rewinding electrical apparatus.

I'm sorry you are in a field that is over crowded with cheap laborers. It is a shame that your experience and quality of workmanship is not appreciated the way it should be.

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Originally Posted by Crappie Reaper

Ok fishing pox, I DO realized how CHEAP certain things are from the illegals being in this country. I agree there are plenty of lazy Americans. But, when one has to literally work their azz off everday, and not make much for their effort, it's easy to be turned away from the work that is available. I think your statement is a copout and if the illegals were not here, there would be someone that would gladly do their job, but it would cost the business owner a bit more (i.e. ins, possible health, etc.). The business owner caught using them should be fined so much, they would have to think twice about having a proper I-9 form on hand for their employees.

This is the first post you have made, that I am sorry, I cannot agree with. Why shouldn't a person, an American, be concerned about the wage paid for his chosen trade? Too bad if veggies and building costs were to have increases due to the workers getting paid for an honest days work. As a Trim Carpenter, they have stagnated, and in most cases reversed the amount each job will pay. I am making less now than I was 15 years ago. I am from the "old school" and take the extra time to make sure a job is done right. I cannot afford an experienced American helper. I should be able to employ other experienced Carpenters @ $15-20 an hour (They deserve a living too). But, because of the influx of illegals, labor stays at a bare minimum. I am down to two builders that will pay the extra .15 a foot that I charge above the illegals because of the quality of detail. And the wage I charge, hasn't changed in 15 years.

I don't know what you do for a living, but, fantasize a group of illegals flooding your market in your chosen work. Then picture the competition getting tougher and tougher price wise. Then, think of what it would be like to possibly, completly lose your job to an illegal. What you have mentioned, is how the upper echelon thinks and does not try to put themselves in someone elses place. They only look at it as keeping prices down for them. I promise you, the cost of residential, or commercial building has only risen in matterials only. The labor on most trades has remained, or been lowered for years now. Most residential builders only profits 3-4k on a small 2-3 bedroom home. The insurance, the fees, the materials have all risen. The price of labor has gone down.

Now there was a time, they did mainly the meanial jobs. But, watch your back. Now their children are gaining education, and your job, or your childrens job, could be next.

The illegals are now able to get home mortgages from American banks. All they need is an ID card, no visa, no passport. I don't blame them at all for wanting a better life. But it does affect my familys income severely. There are so many in the country right now, if we sent them all home, and sealed the borders, it would cause an economic domino effect dissaster.

I have no problem at all with legal immigrants. After all, that is the way of the USA. But, we must seal the borders and at least know who and why someone is here. It's for the TOTAL good.

This is Reapers opinion.

Put the shoe on the other foot and think about it. The government for years has thought the same way as you. I personaly think of it just like a cancer, once it gets started, it grows and grows. And eventually kills the host.

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Goshen Indiana.A small feeder community to the massive Elkhart Indiana RV industry.Goshen was a Amish town. It had some small shops that produced Fiberglass parts/wood products for upscale campers. Some WISEGUY from the RV industry went to the Mexican side of the U.S. Boarder and put up a sign that read "5000 jobs in Elkhart Indiana", when in reality there were only 500.With in a couple months the County had probably 75,000 fresh illegal latin speaking workers. The state welfare system had new applicants. The stores had new customers to spend the welfare checks. The latin youth now brawl with the local kids over "TURF". The winner is the RV industry. It got its free, cheap, workforce at the expence of a community, who now seek white flight,the local education system(now burdoned with latino children who now must be caught up/taught a new language), and every other skilled /higher paid workerin the local vicinity to worry if the brown guy WOP might get my job?Don't fool yourself. For their benifit to a community does not outweigh their burdon to us all.That cheaper tomato did cost you more by the taxes to subsidize the welfare of the migrants family.The school taxes just went up. local, city, and county taxes will follow. The only winner is the guy imploying Pedro, for the cheaper wage.A Boarder Fence/or wall is the only answer. In less than 20 years, California will be more than 50% hispinic. Do your math.George Bush is a failure on boarder security. It does not help when no GOVENOR-Perry,Richardson,Napolitano,or Arnold are notwilling to adress it as a National Security Problem.Their Senaters are really the guilty ones cause they will not rock the boat and risk election to higher offices.Hell, the Goverment couldn't even help in Katrina till the GOVENORS OF THE AFFECTED STATES SAID "PLEASE HELP US.'', and to start a security wall or fence......on state land....Yea right. Every state would have 30 reasons not to. NOW TO DUMP ALL OF THIS STORM on Bush, is stupid. Every state affected was warned earlier by the National Weather Service of the storm.They could have given the goverment Federal control days before.They said we will be fine.

Hello everyone.

I usually just read the post and never really sound off on anything. I just enjoy the conversation but Mr. Crappie Reaper, and some others, did say something that got my attention and that is the part about buying products ie. Ford, Chevy, and Chrysler products. I should explain that I am and have been a worker in the automotive industry for 22 years. I have worked for the Japanese, Canadians, and American companies those years. If anyone truly believes that buying the products that are "American" brand names is supporting US jobs then they are sadly mistaken. Try and remember the last time an "American" automobile company announced they were putting up a new company to build vehicles??? I should not have to tell anyone in the south how many Car companies have built here in the last 20 years. Toyota, Honda, Nissan, BMW, Hondai, and now Kia is looking to build somewhere. All of these companies are hiring Americans. I am not going to go into how many suppliers are building companies to support these. I do know that every month we in the auto industry hear Ford, GM, and Chrysler laying off in the US but building in Mexico, China, and India. Even Chrysler is not American owned. They are Daimler Chrysler. Owned by Mercedes. The whole world is now a Global Economy. If you truly want to help American workers then start writing and talking to all the politicians Democrat and Republican and tell them to protect the workers by putting the taxes and levis on products coming in just the same as the other countries do. If Japan charges $10000.00 on an US built vehicle to come into their country then we should charge the same. If Mexico does not charge anything then we should not on their products. This will give a level playing ground. I truly believe since I have traveled the world and everyone knows that US builds the best product, that we would kick butt in the Global Marketplace if we were all playing the same game and rules. I guess I have said enough but please do not let politician rhetoric mislead people into believing the Buy American thing. Do some investigating. The company may have an American name but the product is built elswhere. To me that is the greatest injustice. Our own buisnessmen selling the US out!! Thanks for the time...