Crappie being line shy ?

I will start with a story on Crappie not being line shy .

I remember old timers using 40 to 60 lb test line with minnows . One trolled a Shad type bait think called a ''Spot '' . I still shyed away from bright colored or heavier line . But since livescope I fished with guys that use nothing but braid even in clear water . I still use mono but mainly because I can't see well enough to untangle braid if I goof up and get it tangled. Have not noticed any difference whether baits on mono or braid with livescope as far as strikes.

I have nowhere near the experience of a lot of the fishermen here, but I need to use hi viz and at least on the stream where I spend the majority of my time I catch plenty enough to feel that the fish are not line shy - crappie or pans. This is in all types of water clarity. I’m happy for that or I would never be able to tie a decent knot.:Rofl
Bob

i am not sure to this day about line shy crappie , sometimes i convince myself it is so and then the next day i am sure it dont matter .
i do know there are trips where my braid rod straight to a jig , got way less bites using the same jig than my mono rod .
i thought that day for sure it was the line ,but , i think its like alot of other things , confidence and presentation are the key factors in most cases.
lets look at it this way ,the brush pile has tiny twigs and other folks line and all sorts of stuff in it . the crappie being a predator probably
isnt in most cases focusing on obstacles as much as the grand prize. :highfive

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Originally Posted by Ketchn

i am not sure to this day about line shy crappie , sometimes i convince myself it is so and then the next day i am sure it dont matter .
i do know there are trips where my braid rod straight to a jig , got way less bites using the same jig than my mono rod .
i thought that day for sure it was the line ,but , i think its like alot of other things , confidence and presentation are the key factors in most cases.
lets look at it this way ,the brush pile has tiny twigs and other folks line and all sorts of stuff in it . the crappie being a predator probably
isnt in most cases focusing on obstacles as much as the grand prize. :highfive

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I’ve come to believe those two items above are truly crucial.
Bob

The only line shy fish I’ve encountered numerous times is the bluegill. Proved it to myself time and time again on many different bodies of water. 2 to 6 pound test clear worked best for me.

Haven't used anything but Hi-Vis braid for years, even fishing the clearest waters in MN. Didn't need a livescope we could actually see the fish.

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Originally Posted by chaunc

The only line shy fish I’ve encountered numerous times is the bluegill. Proved it to myself time and time again on many different bodies of water. 2 to 6 pound test clear worked best for me.

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Only fish I have seen really line shy are Rainbow Shad ( Trout ) :Rofl Usually in super clear water so many times see them . I was watching one once . Could toss a grain of corn and it would eat . Put a tiny hook competely hidden in a grain of corn on 4 lb test . Pitch it in the sucker would run up stop then back off . Repeat tossing Corn and would eat . :crazy:

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Originally Posted by NIMROD

Only fish I have seen really line shy are Rainbow Shad ( Trout ) :Rofl Usually in super clear water so many times see them . I was watching one once . Could toss a grain of corn and it would eat . Put a tiny hook competely hidden in a grain of corn on 4 lb test . Pitch it in the sucker would run up stop then back off . Repeat tossing Corn and would eat . :crazy:

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I agree about trout. The last 10-15 years I fished for trout, I used a 1 or 2 lb fluorocarbon leader and definitely caught more fish with it than without it. Heck, I have even hid behind a tree to cast out to a big ole' trout before I could get him to bite. Really finicky trout can spit out a piece of corn as fast as a crappie spits out a jig.

I switched to hi vis couple years ago and have been ketchn as many with it as not. have used same jig on two different poles with one being clear just to see and didn't notice any difference in results. JMHO as I can see line to knot it and more bites it's definitely increased my ketch and frustration level. When I have to go to 2 lb for winter trout fishing it's so hard for me.

Been using Hi Vis braid for years...in stained and clear water!

I will always use a mono leader on my braid and for two reasons.....1 It's not a question if fish are line shy but a fact at times they are. 2 If I get hung on some structure the mono is several times easier to break.....
We all see the post about that one or two times something didn't matter but what about those stinky skunks you've got in your closet from thinking most things that will definitely help entice crappie to bite are not important..... No one want to talk or post about the times they should have tried more things that several folks have improved their bite on tough days..... You know fighting to stay on fish consistently..... Not just when it's easy.....:dono

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Originally Posted by SKs Crappie Catching Adventures

I will always use a mono leader on my braid and for two reasons.....1 It's not a question if fish are line shy but a fact at times they are. 2 If I get hung on some structure the mono is several times easier to break.....
We all see the post about that one or two times something didn't matter but what about those stinky skunks you've got in your closet from thinking most things that will definitely help entice crappie to bite are not important..... No one want to talk or post about the times they should have tried more things that several folks have improved their bite on tough days..... You know fighting to stay on fish consistently..... Not just when it's easy.....:dono

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We're all different....
I tie braid direct....with a fine wire sickle hook, I can pull and straighten the hook if I ever get hung up!
Don't have any idea what a skunk is!....I put cover in my home lake for 13 years...there are no Pepe Le Pew's here! lol

I use both- it does not matter to fish.

Fish are fish regardless the species. Carp, gold shiners and suckers bite lures attached to braid ! For me though I use the smallest diameter braid that allows the best lure action when using any type of small lure. Diving or surface crankbaits/ jerk baits don' have the same action using large diameter line regardless the type. Same for 1/32 oz jig heads with soft plastic or hair bodies. Built-in lure quiver must be combined with lure-pause action to get the best overall action and lures at pause or starting to move are where strikes occur and are detected - especially with braid.

I use 20 lb braid and have for years. The lake I fish is stained. At times I see fish come up and look at my jig, then swim away. But I've seen them do the same thing with friends who fish lightweight mono. So I can't say that the line makes that much difference in catching but I seldom have a fish break off from me since I switched to braid.

I'm so superstitious, I will not tie a yellow section of Mr Crappie Camo line to my jig............if possible I tie a red section.

I use a 2-4 lb leader attached to hi vis.
It’s all about confidence for me. Are the fish line-shy? I can’t say for sure but since I switch to 2-4, I catch more.

As mentioned earlier, same for trout.


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i have had a day or 2 when i think clear mono got me bit ,the only reason i tend to think that is the others around me using hi vis and braid were just in audience and not the actual actors in the performance :Rofl

all kidding aside , if you hit high pressure locations where the fish see all the regular i will just pull my jig out of the brush braid folks and the hi vis big bait folks and the other etc etc etc that goes along with making a fish wise and spooky at public locations anyone can fish ,then you will most assuredly understand this particular thread much better than if you hit the less educated/spooked fish i promise :highfive

Trout really can be line shy, that’s for sure - especially in gin clear water. I mentioned once that I became so frustrated when I was fly fishing that I finally threw rocks at them. Not my best day on the water....:Rofl
Bob

Another interesting topic. While I know Nimrod piles up fish and respect his opinion, don’t necessarily agree on this one like I didn’t on jig color/style either. I think it probably has a lot to with what lake your on and the fish population at a given time. While it may not matter to a lot or even most fish, think there are times it matters, especially in a tournament situation where a couple of big bites can take you from zero to hero quickly. I have always felt like I get more bites on fluorocarbon or fluorocarbon leader on braid here on my lakes. Like SK I have always preferred some kind of leader with braid if for no other reason to break off a little easier instead of destroying cover when hung.

This isn’t just my observation either for my home waters of Kentucky Lake and Lake Barkley either. Anyone that has watched much of Josh Jones videos knows he is a big advocate of 20lb braid straight to the jig 99 percent of the time. But when he won the Crappie USA Megabucks tournament here fishing Lake Barkley last summer he stated one of the keys to winning the tournament was recognizing that he couldn’t get the fish to bite going straight to jig with braid. He made the switch to a braid to fluorocarbon setup like some of us have used here for years and won the tournament. And for those not familiar with Lake Barkley, it’s not a clear water lake at all. While that is far from scientific, it is still food for thought for those of you on the fence. The interview is still up somewhere on Facebook, I believe on Josh’s page around June of last year, for anyone that wants to hear his account their self.


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I use 20 lb braid on my dipping rods and 8 lb mono on my casting rods.

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Originally Posted by rojoguio

I'm so superstitious, I will not tie a yellow section of Mr Crappie Camo line to my jig............if possible I tie a red section.

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I laugh about people were pushing red line said it disappeared under water . Then next ones saying red bait were the deal . Some even were saying red hooks made a difference . Use whatever you have confidence in is my mind set . :twocents

Line weight to me is an easy thing. I like the lightest I thing I can get away with. I finally found a spool of 2# to put on my UL reels/rods and love it. Before that I was stuck with 4# and actually it worked fine. Then to where I fish for them they run about 8"-10". Biggest I've ever caught was 13" and only one that big, 2# line handled it just fine. On my cat fish rods about as heavy as I go is 14# and that's only because I have a bunch laying around. Like 10# there. Over in Germany in the AF, we'd get crystal sewing thread from the BX and use it on UL rods and reels to catch trout. Down side was setting a hook on say a 15" tout could easily break the line. Wish I could find the stuff again to use for crappie! I try to not spend a lot of time wondering is the fish can see my line.

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Originally Posted by Don Fischer

I try to not spend a lot of time wondering is the fish can see my line.

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This! I always have a mix of about four rod/reels ready on my deck. I may pick up one for a crappie or one for a smallmouth. I've caught smallmouth on my crappie rods that have hi-vis on them and crappie on ones that have a flouro leader. My absolute favorite is a baitcast rig that will easily throw 1/16 oz jigs. I have caught many crappie as well as bass, 'eyes and sand bass on it and a few other species. It always has 4 or 6lb hi-vis with a short flouro leader on it. It's just what I like to use.

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My question is is it actually the line or is it the action different lines give a lure. The Trout and corn post was it really the line or did the line cause the corn to fall and not look as natural? Did switching to mono after braid made the presentation fall slower or gave the bait a little different action. To many if`s come into this question to make an absolute decision on what really made the bite change from one type of line to the next. Me I like my high viz Mono lines....or braid.

I've said it before ... there may be many "other" circumstances at play that "spook" fish. I haven't found line color to be a major factor, as I'm catching just as many fish, and possibly more, using hi-vis lines. I say "possibly more" because having aged I'm not as able to see clear lines as easily as I did in the past, when casting was my go-to method & line watching for the telltale jump in the line indicated a fish engulfing my jig. Since transitioning to hi-vis lines, that's been mostly eliminated.
Where I fish, & especially on one lake in particular, water levels can & do rise well above Pool levels, but the lake can still be fished. Many times, once the water levels have receded back to "normal", one can easily observe multiple colors of lines dangling from the now exposed tree limbs. Noting that, one can only surmise that the limbs of trees that never show above the water (even during Winter Drawdown) are probably even more entwined with lines of all colors & sizes. YET, those same trees still do hold fish. So, with that in mind, I don't see how fish would be "line shy" when those very same colors of lines are decorating their habitat.

I Push jigs with 30# braid and 20# hi-vis mono ... both with 1oz trolling sinkers & various colors of leader lines. The fish can definitely see either main lines & the big trolling sinker well before the leader line & jig come into play. If they were "line shy" wouldn't they move away before the jig ever got close ?? And some of my leaders are hi-vis, so wouldn't that also spook those fish ?? They don't & they haven't as is evident when I bring in fish after fish using this method. And most of the time my lines are no more than 20-25ft out ... and my rods are angled out from the bow of my 16ft boat, which means that the trolling sinker & jigs are practically under the back of the boat (about 12-15ft deep) and the fish don't shy away from the boat or noise of the trolling motor or the multiple pings from my electronics, nor the highly visible braid or hi-vis mono that precedes the sinker & hi-vis leader. And I'm not fishing muddy or murky water, but lightly stained water with a couple of feet of visibility at times.
Your situations may be different ... but, for me, I'm in the "not line shy" camp. :twocents

Color does not matter and I can prove it. I've used every color of line for years. Still have not caught a fish. Oh wait... that "other factor" may be ME! :biggrin

Years ago, I got into a spirited discussion regarding flourocarbon line being invisible. I was told that due to it’s molecular structure, it is invisible. To which I replied, so it is also invisible in 400 lb test as well then. Obviously 400lb test flourocarbon line is not invisible.

I also enjoy the red disappears discussions. I dropped a bright red bead down into a deep hole at the local springs one hot summer day. Yup, even at 30+ feet down, I could still see that bright red bead just shining away.

People who sell lures and line and such realize that it must first catch a fisherman. We should be grateful that we are able to simply use what we want to catch them stupid fish. Imagine if we were limited to just one way, or one line.

the entire red isnt visible to a fish thing at certain depths is for sure bla bla bla and to prove it just pull out an eyeball and replace it with a fresh crappie eyeball ....then you will truly see what the crappie can or cannot see ......:Rofl
on a side note ....one day 3 of us dipped jigs , all 3 good at it ,,,,,fish were biting REALLY well .....
number 3 was using cajun red fire line and could NOT get a peck ......
he insisted it made no difference and cited 14 different reasons why and made 32 excuses why he couldnt get bit ......
he remained stubborn and watched us sling them , after about an hour of us saying maybe its that there red line .....
i finally talked him into using my spare rod and GUESS what .....
immediate and NON stop KABOOM for him as well .... !
we still laugh about that day and he aint never bought another spool of it since :Rofl

I think the deal is red color turns black underwater first before any other color. Having competed all over the nation achieving top ranks you do the same thing over and over that includes eating the exact same breakfast, using the exact same ammo, wearing the same gloves, etc of the days you won championships. I catch crappie for years now with Mr Crappie Camo over any other line. Tying the knot to a red portion has nothing to do with the color for me as is has to do with the last 5000 crappie I caught that portion of the line is what was tied to the jig. Confidence, confidence catches fish.

I’m glad you mentioned the camo line. I just bought the crappie max camo line on BPS sale and with all the talk on red was starting to wonder if I wasted my money since it has some red. I usually use hi-viz but have been switching more and more to clear.

I got a bud that slings fish quite well with mr. crappie camo line
I prefer no color line myself ,but I also frequently use hi vis
and sometimes braid ....I said sometimes
I never tested the red cajun fire line myself with any crappie though
but I used a bunch of it in Alaska on salmon and trout and it seemed to work ok there .
I used to see an older fella back when use cotton line straight to a big gold crappie hook with a shiner under a float with a cane pole and do pretty well just like that ....
the problem in the end will always remain the same though, folks just dont get what we see and what a crappie might or might not see are TOTALLY different , our blue isnt their blue and our red isnt their red and etc etc etc .
there in lies the real issue of concern :highfive
heck I still have not ever seen a for sure scientific to make me believe it study on if they can EVEN see the fish world in actual color.
their eye sight might be similar to how a cat views the world ,black and white and objects that move seem highlighted in a brighter shade of white .
that particular study seemed to make me think it was true .

I don't worry about line color, i only fish for blind crappie?:juggle

Would say normally i can't tell any difference. One day we were casting jigs for Crappie, buddy was out fishing me 4-1 I had Hi vis he had clear mono both had exact same jigs. He finally said here try one of my poles, right away I started matching him 1-1. So that day it mattered. This was a reservoir w/moderately clear water .

My dad used a black nylon line so thick that the bobber stop was a loop in the main line . Fished clear water in the summer time with no issues . They used minnows so small is you tried hooking them in the back would cut them in half . no problems even on a big catfish go involved .

I've fished for crappie with ultra clear line and I've used hi-vis as well. I have #30 braid on all my trolling rods that ends in a flourocarbon leader #6 to #8 lbs. I've fished in ultra clear water, and water as muddy as the Miss. River. But I can't say that line color, or even line size for that matter, ever has really made a difference. I honestly believe that the fishing market has become such a big business that most of the stuff being hawked as "best" or "sure to improve your catch" is made FOR THE FISHERMAN AND NOT THE FISH! For instance, think about the numerous kinds and brands of plastic jigs on the market today. There are literally thousands of kinds and colors, but they basically are all the same. I've got hundreds of colors and styles of jigs in my boat and usually use maybe 5 or 6 different colors or kinds most of the time. All those jigs are made for THE FISHERMAN, not the FISH. Do I need hundreds of kinds of plastic jigs? No. Do I need 500 brands of fishing line to guarantee success? No. Honestly, I could probably stick to 6 to 10lb Stren and catch as many crappie as I ever have. Fishing, like most everything else in America, boils down to big business. Today I fish out of a $30,000 boat with $10,000 worth of electronics and $100 fishing rods, but if the truth be known, I probably caught just as many (or more) crappie back in the day when I used a cane pole, 30 lb nylon line, a 3/0 gold Eagle Claw hook and a big plastic red and white bobber. Folks, I know some of you will disagree, but I think most of this stuff being marketed today is aimed at the FISHERMAN and not the FISH.

Changing line diameter has more to do with sink rate for me than visibility. As quoted earlier by Mr Ketchn, 400# fluorocarbon is far from invisible. I bet it would not sink 12ft with a 1/16oz jig, but it is heavier than water I think so mute point. Displacement of water is a key factor to a jigs presentation, line shy or not in the particular situation where if slower sink rates trigger strikes, larger diameter line for a given jig weight helps regulate the sink rate. I am very guilty of dropping to 6# Mr Crappie if I catch myself thinking about line visibility, as all my focus is on using the Force to "Feel" it's time to set the hook during the "Winter" bite.

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Originally Posted by rojoguio

Changing line diameter has more to do with sink rate for me than visibility. As quoted earlier by Mr Ketchn, 400# fluorocarbon is far from invisible. I bet it would not sink 12ft with a 1/16oz jig, but it is heavier than water I think so mute point. Displacement of water is a key factor to a jigs presentation, line shy or not in the particular situation where if slower sink rates trigger strikes, larger diameter line for a given jig weight helps regulate the sink rate. I am very guilty of dropping to 6# Mr Crappie if I catch myself thinking about line visibility, as all my focus is on using the Force to "Feel" it's time to set the hook during the "Winter" bite.

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Yes larger diameter equals more drag and slower fall . One old guy using heavier line and lighter jig said he never felt the bite as it was so light once . We were using 8 lb test with 1/8 oz jigs , they were hammering a bait . Line diameter matters but line color I don't think so most times .

I've had Old-timers fishing right along side me with huge corks, hooks and line pulling up just as many fish as me, with all my high tech stuff... go figure ...Lol