Cranking and long lining.

I have had a couple of people ask questions about trolling crank baits, pushing, and long lining. Every year I end up posting a few comments as it seems to answer and educate those that are seeking information and so here goes. Also, to make this thread everybody’s, feel free to give your thoughts and comments and even correct my thought process as it’s always a learning experience for me and I am always looking for new techniques on crappie fishing to learn as well. I don’t know it all and no matter how you fish, you always have good days and days you bite the bullet and get skunked also.

Every body of water is different. Every time you fish, weather patterns change the conditions and so does the seasons and time of year your fishing in. Even the time of day can change the fishing conditions. For every lake, I have paper maps, and map cards for my electronics. I use them to find things like structure that may hold fish. Hot Maps is a good paper map. Structure can be anything from weed beds, to creek channels, stump beds, trees, rocks, bridges, building foundations, humps, you name it. Also, maps will give you varied depths you might be looking for.

Rods to pull cranks with, If your starting out, any rodmyou can cast a crankbaits with will work. Any size will work. Any reel will work, but,the line counter reels take all the guess work out of trolling cranks. Trolling has been around forever since a bait was used to fish with. The Mississippi boys put it all together and the best read on cranking is this: http://www.crappie.com/crappie/missi...-cranks-101-a/. I know it’s a long read, but it’s well worth it if you want to learn. About 6-7 yrs ago, I read it bumpiest times and still get the postings on it. But the guys in Mississippi, refined cranking for crappies thru their trial and error and is all there.

I use Arkies, Bandits, and PICOs and have couple 100 of them. I have used a ton of rods and now using Southern Pros. A good line counter reel is a Shakespeare’s to start out with, I like the Okuma DX 15 and 20s as I have a half dozen of each. You can use 10 lb mono, but I like the braid as it’s no stretch, some like the stretch factor tho. I use power pro yellow slick 10lb equal to 4 lb mono in dia. And 20 lb braid which is equal to 6lb mono in dia.

Speed is what works best for you. In the spring, I move slow, 1.2 or 1.3 mph to 1.6 is my fav speed and summer you can speed up to as much as 2.0. I used the Bandit chart attached for my depths to run my crankbaits. Right now as the larger fish haven’t come up to spawn yet, they are deep, so I run my crankbaits about 1 to 3’ off the bottom on structure of stump beds and the edges of Creek channels, humps, etc., and loose a few as they get snagged. Depth is determined by how much line I am letting out. HINT! It’s determined by where the line enters the water, not from the tip of your pole so add the distance from the tip of the pole to where it enters the water to get a good read on the depth the lure is running. Add a foot if using PICOs as they will run a foot deeper than the arkies and bandits. Later in the year after the spawn, in reading my electronics and seeing the depth of the fish, that will determine the depth I am going to run my crankbaits.

If I am pushing crankbaits, I use the the same speeds to push. My favorite pushing speed is 1.4—1.6 mph. I use 3 oz trolling weights, then add 3’ of mono and tie my clasp then attach the crankbaits. I catch as many pushing as I pull, but your going to want to use a more stronger rod with the weight added. Some guys prefer 2 oz weights. Attached is the pushing chart. I fish out of 16’ jon boat so person in the back can long line and I can push in the front if I don’t want to long line. Person in the back will use 7’ rods while I am up front pushing using 10 and 12’ rods. I prefer the 12’s over 14’ or,16’ as that’s my preference to use.

I use Hi Tek rod holders and I also have Creekslicks Rod Transport Rack to transport my rods in. You can find Creekslick in the forum if you do a search or pm me and will get his info for you as well as Hi Tek. There are also other forum supporters that make rod holders and transport racks.

Long Lining jigs — this a very good read on long lining jigs. http://magnoliacrappieclub.com/articles/LongLining.pdf

I also use 3/4 oz weight with 3’ of line attached to bottom of it with jig tied to push jigs off front of boat
moving 0.4 to as much as 1.0 mph with my preferred speed of 0.8 mph.

Starting out, you can use the same rods for cranking as long lining jigs. I have 10’ and 12’ for long lining jigs and use the spinning reels. Some prefer small low profile baitcasters and even zebco reels, so it’s,a matter of preference.

I hope this answers some questions and if not, ask away. Also, others need to add to this as there are so many techniques and diff. equipment that is out there. I use artificial baits only even when I have spider rigged. I don’t spider rig that much as I would rather vertical jig and sometimes also will cast a jig or dip it using 8 and 10’ rods especially in timber at Patoka.

I caught crappie on crankbaits 3 weeks ago in 51 degree water. Read the Mississippi crankbaits 101 and Major Flyboy won a tourney crankin in 40 ish degree water. Crankin is another style of fishing and very productive. If you get hooked on it, it will cost you alittle money to get setup, but about any crankbaits will catch crappie. I started trolling for walleye and lake trout in Canada in 72. Got hooked on salmon when it was hot in the Great Lakes and had a 26’ cuddly cabin Mark Twain setup with down riggers, out riggers, loran c as gps hadn’t been envented yet, Lowrance X 16 paper graphs was the hot depth finder, plainer boards and dips divers also used, and spent about 15 weekends a year chasing salmon and walleyes in the Great Lakes for 8-10 yrs. Trolling can be super productive and is nothing new as it’s been around forever and another way to catch a ton of fish. :ThumbsUp

I would second the map cards, its very important to follow the contour lines and not just wander around aimlessly. The ipilot was the best thing since sliced bread if you intend to troll, there's no comparison. I long line with a 1/16 and a 1/24, usually my hand tied. Speed will determine depth. Also not ever talked about, but two things that have put many fish in my boat. When pulling cranks, sometimes a small jerkbait or tiny crank pulled with weights and 3 way swivels will be deadly. Also don't be afraid to pull shallow cranks in deep water, crappie suspend over open water way more than people think. Drift socks, buckets, chains... Are all part of the equipment. I have also marked fish many times that won't bite going one direction, but swing around and come back the other way and all rods get slammed. It's all about how they are positioned and light penetration. If I usually pull with a double seat out of the back staggering rods from 11 on the outside down to 6 foot on the inside of the rod racks. Trolling catches fish year round, and the bigger whites I feel are caught this way. I haven't fished shallow water all year other than being in Mississippi in cypress swamps, and I probably won't in Indiana this year.

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I think it was Rees Guide in the Mississippi forum last year, was trolling crankbaits in 2 ft of water with only 5 ft of water out and going next to flooded bushes and buck brush in the shallows nailing big crappies with crankbaits. I tried it with my 12’ rods last year on Cataract and Monroe. On the Cat. I had my 300 series Bandits and Arkies set 2’ deep and caught good fish spawning over the shallow points near deep water. On Monroe, with high water, nailed a ton of fish along the bushes and flooded trees super shallow. The fish will come right out of the cover and hit the baits when they,are feeding no matter how shallow you troll at certain times. I need to troll more out of the back of the boat but can never bring myself to stay off the front for line control. I guess it goes back to my Bass Fishing Tourney days. Sat and Sunday, trolling off the front, I lost 8 to 10 super nice fish head shaking the bait out and might have had better results working from the back as I found myself getting up and landing the bigger fish from the back anyway. Old habits,are hard to break. Great info Locator79.

Wow thanks for all the info. I have had bandits forever and did not now there was a line chart [dummy me], that bit of data right there is gonna help a hole bunch. I am going out tomorrow night, and cant wait to give it a try. I think you or maybe locator may have said that it is ok to pull cranks and jigs at the same time, if not correct me please, but that would seem to be a good way to find out what the fish prefer, what's your opinion on that. And hope to see you on the water sometime, tight lines to you.

I guess you could.. But I pull cranks way faster than I pull jigs

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Here is some temperature information from West Boggs today taken with a hand held Lowrance FishnTemp that I have had for at least 30 yrs and it’s accurate as I checked it with my 3 depth finders temp on the boat. In the main lake, just right after I launched at 2:30 pm today, surface temp was 71.3. 5 ft below the surface it was 60 degrees. 10 ft down in 25 ft of water, the temp was 58. In the west bay of Boggs after you go thru the big graded pipe into the west bay the surface temp was 74.5 in 8’ of water in the middle and on the bottom the temp was 58. This is why you see me occasionally comment not all fish spawn at the same time. Deeper water is still colder than the temps I took and larger lakes will probably have colder water below the surface. West Boggs is only 650 acres.

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WOW!! I never thought there would be that much difference. I guess that's why the fish i caught this past weekend were cold.

Chance

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Originally Posted by coach mark

Wow thanks for all the info. I have had bandits forever and did not now there was a line chart [dummy me], that bit of data right there is gonna help a hole bunch. I am going out tomorrow night, and cant wait to give it a try. I think you or maybe locator may have said that it is ok to pull cranks and jigs at the same time, if not correct me please, but that would seem to be a good way to find out what the fish prefer, what's your opinion on that. And hope to see you on the water sometime, tight lines to you.

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crankbaits are normally run 1.4 to 2.2 max. Jigs are lonlined from 0.3 or 0.4 to 1.1 Max not saying you can’t run,jigs faster but they will climb higher in the water column the faster you go unless you use a heavier jig or add weight. The 2 don’t mix too good.

And

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Originally Posted by Chance

WOW!! I never thought there would be that much difference. I guess that's why the fish i caught this past weekend were cold.

Chance

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There was gills and red ears starting to spawn today in 1 to 4 ft of water.

The line chart for bandits was based on a speed of 1.6 mph using 6 lb test line. I use the chart for arkies and PICOs but the PICO’s will run a foot deeper than the arkies and bandits. I also think the dimpled sides of the PICO’s give off more water vibrations that fish can feel. Bandits and arkies are smooth sided baits. And you have a lot other kinds of crankbaits that also work as good. I also have downloaded,on my iPhone a program that lists all crankbaits and how deep they will run and it’s called Precision Trolling. You have to purchase it to use it.

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Originally Posted by cevans

crankbaits are normally run 1.4 to 2.2 max. Jigs are lonlined from 0.3 or 0.4 to 1.1 Max not saying you can’t run,jigs faster but they will climb higher in the water column the faster you go unless you use a heavier jig or add weight. The 2 don’t mix too good.

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Ok, cranks tomorrow night, and jigs Thursday night, I'll let you know how I did trying both. once again thank you.

Whats the preferred method of pulling cranks with I pilot?

Follow contour seems to turn to abruptly, I've fiddled with waypoints, but its alot of clicking- unless I save them I guess.

How do you all pull cranks with I-pilot?

I use ipilot to guide with as I do all the driving to where I want to go and record my tracks and then replay them if I want to work a specific area. Others might follow contours but I prefer to go over the points and humps working the different levels of depths till the fish strike the cranks to determine the active fish. I do use advanced autopilot and cruise control also. Just never got into the contour mode.

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Originally Posted by binfordw

Whats the preferred method of pulling cranks with I pilot?

Follow contour seems to turn to abruptly, I've fiddled with waypoints, but its alot of clicking- unless I save them I guess.

How do you all pull cranks with I-pilot?

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You can't always stay on a ledge or ditch etc. if a large turn comes up unless you are pushing with sinkers. I do like cevans and record my tracks and let ipilot do all the work until I'm ready to relocate.

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Fish face into the current. Wind in a lake can set up small currents. On the windward face of a land mass, the wind can create back currents so the fish may be facing the land mass and into the wind near the land mass. Otherwise, the open areas will have a current that goes with the winds.

Note: The Bandit Depth Charts were based on using 10 lb test mono and that the diameter of 10 lb test mono line determines the Dept of the bandit crankbaits more than the speed from 0.8 mph to 2 mph. So if you use the braided line that's much thinner in diameter than mono line your bandit crankbaits will go deeper than the chart indicated for 10 lb mono line.

I have a copy of the Trollers Bible which I bought at Gander Mountain.

One more trick that I use. I got this trolling trick from the Herter's Guide Book many years ago. Tie a jig on the back hook of the crankbait. Use about 18" of thinner mono line to tie the jig on. I use a small 1/16 oz jig. The fish will attack the training jig behind the crankbait. This method is on FIRE. I catch Largemouth Bass, Crappie, and lots of Sunfish out over the deepest water in the lake using this method and letting out up to 200 ft of 10 lb test mono and a bandit 300 or 400 crankbait. The longer the bill on the crankbait the deeper it dives generally. The thinner the diameter of the line the less friction between the line and the water and the deeper the line will go as does the crankbait.

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Originally Posted by Locator79

I would second the map cards, its very important to follow the contour lines and not just wander around aimlessly. The ipilot was the best thing since sliced bread if you intend to troll, there's no comparison. I long line with a 1/16 and a 1/24, usually my hand tied. Speed will determine depth. Also not ever talked about, but two things that have put many fish in my boat. When pulling cranks, sometimes a small jerkbait or tiny crank pulled with weights and 3 way swivels will be deadly. Also don't be afraid to pull shallow cranks in deep water, crappie suspend over open water way more than people think. Drift socks, buckets, chains... Are all part of the equipment. I have also marked fish many times that won't bite going one direction, but swing around and come back the other way and all rods get slammed. It's all about how they are positioned and light penetration. If I usually pull with a double seat out of the back staggering rods from 11 on the outside down to 6 foot on the inside of the rod racks. Trolling catches fish year round, and the bigger whites I feel are caught this way. I haven't fished shallow water all year other than being in Mississippi in cypress swamps, and I probably won't in Indiana this year.

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That's not always the case

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Originally Posted by Moveon

Fish face into the current. Wind in a lake can set up small currents. On the windward face of a land mass, the wind can create back currents so the fish may be facing the land mass and into the wind near the land mass. Otherwise, the open areas will have a current that goes with the winds.

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Originally Posted by Locator79

That's not always the case

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i would have to agree. There are lots of times I go into the wind and waves and take the beating catching fish, then turn around and go the same track back drifting and the catch is just as good. Same goes for a bank I might troll that is wave swept. Even in a creek channel I have worked up stream then turned around and hammered fish going with the current. Sometimes however, it’s better fishing as the fish hit the baits better drifting. I just don’t know when that is best until I have made my sweeps both ways. I think tho, most of us would rather go with the wind than take the beating into the waves, but, I am the hard headed type and in a 1648 g3 flat bottom jon boat and take a beating. :Rofl Flat bottom serves my purpose when I am on the river in class 1ish rapids occasionally and I just like the stability of it for a skinny water boat.

I power troll jigs and pull cranks at the same time.

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Originally Posted by fishervet

I power troll jigs and pull cranks at the same time.

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what speeds do you do both? Educate me please. And what size jigs mixed with cranks? I have considered both at the same time.

I pull unpainted deep divers with no hooks with a jig and leader tied m, or small spoon. Deadly for roaming wipers. But that's the extent of my pulling two at once. I like to keep it all uniform, it the OCD in me.

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Bump for those that are messaging me. Read this thread.