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I just read an article dated May 13, 2016 from Mississippi Today. It said a company has made arrangements with the COE and plans to convert all of the Big 4 flood control lake dams to hydroelectric power plants. I've never heard of such a project in development. Just wondering if it is all bs or if it is legit. Seems to me the water flow would be too inconsistent over time to be feasible. I have often thought the COE should have done this on the Tenn-Tom, just like Pickwick.
Thanks for the info Chris.That's pretty wild right there!It ought to bring some much needed revenue to those areas with jobs and maybe lower folks power bills!
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Crear said converting the four dams to produce hydropower will create more than 100 jobs in the area during the construction period, and two or three permanent jobs after that.
He said bringing a renewable source of energy to the region will also bring an investment of more than $80 million.
“After I retired from a 33-year worldwide military career, my wife and I wanted to give back to the community that was responsible for our success in life,” Crear said of his career that included heading various divisions of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers and the Mississippi River Commission.
“The fact that our projects would be the first to bring hydro-power to our home state makes me feel good and satisfied that I am giving back to the people of Mississippi.”
According to the U.S. Department of Energy’s website, Mississippi is one of two states – the other being Delaware – that does not use hydropower for electricity.
Hydropower captures energy from flowing water to make electricity. Turbines and generators convert that energy into electricity, which is fed into an electrical grid for use in homes and businesses.
LeRoy Coleman, spokesman for the National Hydropower Association, said hydropower is an ideal option for states seeking clean energy solutions.
"States like Mississippi are looking to reduce their carbon footprint," Coleman said. "They can look to resources like hydropower."
Coleman said hydropower has been the country’s largest source of renewable energy. He also said hydropower helps the nation avoid more than 200 million tons of carbon dioxide emissions annually – the equivalent of 42 million cars.
According to environmental assessment documents for the projects, the regulatory commission approved a license for the Yazoo Basin hydropower projects for they would be “dependable sources of electrical energy … would come from a renewable resource that does not contribute to atmospheric pollution” and would “protect and enhance environmental resources affected.”
“FERC must ensure that a project is best adapted to a comprehensive plan for improving or developing a waterway or waterways for the use or benefit of interstate or foreign commerce,” said Celeste Miller, spokeswoman for the commission. “for the improvement and utilization of waterpower development; for the adequate protection, mitigation, and enhancement of fish and wildlife; and for other beneficial public uses, including irrigation, flood control, water supply, recreation, and other purposes. We also must consider the need for power.”
FFP New Hydro has two investors: US Renewables Group of Santa Monica, Calif. and Crestline Investors of Dallas.
Pablo Diaz, executive director of the Grenada Economic Development District, said his community is looking forward to the construction of the hydropower project at the Grenada dam.
"The economic impact from the investment and job creation are important to our region as well as the positive impact it will have as a source of clean energy," Diaz said in an email. "We look forward to supporting FFP New Hydro as they invest and create jobs in our community."
Something doesn't seem right about it to me. If it is true why hasn't it been more publicized? You would think it would be big news now if they plan to start in 2017. The article goes on to say the cost is 80 million and will provide power to 15 thousand homes. That's $53,333.34 per home, I have no idea if that is a good cost per home or not. Of course I know the homeowner would not pay for this, but if these projects fail someone will pay. It also says only 100 construction jobs would be created and only 3-4 full time positions once in operation. That doesn't sound feasible at all. I'm not saying I'm for it or against it, need more information, IF THIS IS EVEN TRUE. Like I said earlier, it's hard to believe something like this has been kept quiet.
If it is true why hasn't it been more publicized?
No room for good news in the media. They are too busy trying to turn races against each other. And they are doing a great job at it. Its wild how much they can cut and edit and make a criminal apprear as the victim.
I will email Artie Monday and try to get a statement from them at grenada. It takes current and that's not something they can guarantee
Tread carefully when someone shows up and says, "I'm from the government and here to help you."
Ima call bs on that one. Think I would have heard if they were gonna put a new hydro-electric dam on Grenada. But.......... who knows?
Lots of info. Page 45 is most relevant to this discussion. Found the cost/return ratio would not justify power stations in this report.
https://books.google.com/books?id=1x...%20dam&f=false
I first heard of this in 2012 I had always wondered why it wasn't done when first built these reservoirs. These will be smaller hydroelectric generators but I had initially heard each would service around 15000 homes
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can do nothing but screw it up. 25 years ago on the Arkansas River the flow would be perfect for weeks at a time. Then they put the hydro plant at Notrebes bend dam. From then on they hold water back until they want to generate and then flow the crap out of it. Then they shut it off til they want to flow again. you have either a dead lake or a too high flow rate. Fishing can be ok at times but not like it was. any time the government does anything to a good lake they screw iot up. Also, bet those folks who are gonna get that electricity won't be locals but in Louisiana or BFE. Arkansas helped pay for Nuclear ! but get none of the juice. At least they didn't when it was built.
Probably want to drain the lakes in case they want to work on these..
If the Corp adheres to its rule curve on lake levels, l don't see how it's practical.
Yep.....I don't see how it would be on a flood control lake.......looks like the cost would exceed any benefits because of irregular current flowQuote:
Originally Posted by rockmike
It works on Toledo Bend. It is twice as big as Grenada.It's is the best big bass lake in the country.
Toledo Bend Reservoir - Toledo Bend Dam and Generating Station
Exactly JR, Toledo Bend is probably 3-4 times the size of Granada, if not larger. They generate power from the generators only when they release water - a steady current is not necessary as some claim to sustain such a project. Conservation is the key, and you're right, Toledo Bend is the number one bass lake in the country. As far as generating x power to x amount of homes with a given amount of x dollars to build such a project, one must consider the payout after 10 years or so. Simple business sense. I often wondered why folks didn't install them when building a dam. They do in Texas.Quote:
Originally Posted by jig rig
I would say it may be possible. It's just one of those things where some people work out a scheme to get rich.It does not matter if its practical or needed. You start a company and work up some bogus numbers to show its viable,lobby some congressmen to support it. They manipulate some bills for some pork...job gets funded,some people get rich and politician gets some type of kick back you will probably never hear about. Taxpayer is stuck with the bill and cost of operation from now on. Even if it loses money.
10 years later some reporter is running article"Hydropower project in Mississippi is not fulfilling promise for cheap and sustainable power."
Does not matter...guy who conceived it put a million he skimmed off of it in an offshore account...sent two kids to an ivy league college...and bought a vacation house in Palm Beach Fl and a big yacht and does not work anymore. Mission accomplished.
Could not have been said better!Quote:
Originally Posted by doggone
Meanwhile.....they have to tear out a new cleaning station and can't figure out how to install a floating dock at Sardis. This will be another comedy of errors.
Epic post.Quote:
Originally Posted by doggone
One thing you left out: In the event that flood control AND power generation trump the old faithful disclaimer of, "These lakes are for flood control, not fishing.", I cannot see how the fishing would NOT be hurt to some degree. Grenada is shallow and, if you do some reading, is not silting in as bad as originally predicted, but I would imagine that regular, strong current flows would increase siltation. Therefore the reservoir's lifespan would be drastically reduced? It certainly wouldn't help things.
That is why Ross Barnett is such a luxury for Mississippians: the environment those fish live in is so much more stable than the COE lakes. I can't see how adding one more factor to the COE equation (constant, erratic current flows) would increase fishing success, and thereby increase the economic boom-town that Grenada and surrounding areas turn into during spring. Size/pole limits? Yes, THAT increases the lore of the area's lakes, but even more erratic conditions? (As a disclaimer: I fully believe the COE reservoirs serve their purpose, and, as designed, should always put the safety of MS citizens over the safety of a fish any day of the week. It is the nature of the beast, and it is the challenge of uncertain conditions that draws me to these lakes.)
But, to add to the post above, once again, the citizen-taxpayers and their local economy risk taking a very very big hit in the wallet over the long-term.
The rivers we trout fish on in Arkansas produce hydro electricity. in the winter they have the spillway open a lot more than summer which is kind of how the big 4 are. In the summer they open the spillway everyday starting in the afternoon and cut it off late at night.
When you guys start talking about Texas and Arkansas your not comparing apples to apples. More like Grapefruit to plums. The 4 lakes hold no volume of water. Especially Arkabutla and Grenada. Those lakes are so shallow the surface area does not correspond to the cubic ft of water like those huge lakes that have really deep areas and a pretty steady inflow of water. I can envision popping the gates open to generate for a few days then being high and dry for weeks or months if you didn't have steady year round rains which we don't. Just another Boondoggle to make someone rich.
The county added turbines and generators to our low head dams on the White at and above Batesville touting how we'd never have another poor day from all the revenue they'd produce. Now the bonds are in default and they don't consistently produce enough electricity to power anything. They're an eyesore and the county's credit rating is in the crapper. I'm sure someone made money though.
My source says that "a company" is researching this and that is all, the COE has made no decisions and is in the very early stages of even considering it.
The proposed hydroelectric facilities have been in the conceptual phase for several years. Recently they have received some of their licenses and are now working towards the actual approved design and construction phase. There are still several more steps for them to go through. These facilities will operate based on the current rule curve and release schedule of the 4 MS Lakes. We will NOT change the operation of the lakes. These hydro plants will be built along the outlet channel at each lake. They will utilize the current that we provide under normal operation. IE: when we are not releasing, they are not getting any power. These facilities have been in the talks for several years and have been discussed with the local Lake Champions. There have also been local town hall meetings and news releases in the local towns and newspapers. I'm sure as the designs get finalized and it gets ready for construction, there will be additional meetings. Again, there will be no change to operations and should be minimal, if any, affect on recreational opportunities at the outlet channels.
PS. The cleaning station at Sardis had to be torn out due to things other than fish being put into them. We have had the materials for the dock at Sardis for 2 years but high water has hindered us. We plan on putting it in this fall/winter. We are also working on getting docks for Enid and Arkabutla. The big fluctuation in water levels has been a challenge for these dock designs but we are working through the challenges.
I find it pretty hard to believe. Water has to moving to generate electicity. It has to be cut off for flood control. The two just don't go together.
There was plans for this 8-10 years ago . Not sure about the others but deal on Enid was very small . You will not be looking at another Pickwick .
If it's beneficial and the returns outweigh the cost, then I would say go for it. I'm with some of the others who kind of view this as a scheme or a political stunt. It's odd as well that with all these news releases and town hall meetings that this is the first a lot of people have heard of this idea, and little is to be found on the topic. Kind of seems like since the licenses have been obtained and construction plans are being made that it's going to happen wether the tax payers like it or not. Don't know about the other 3, but at Arkabutla they would be better off installing wind turbines, a lot more wind on the lake then water released into the outlet channel in any given year IMO.. but I've never known government to waste any tax dollars, no sir.. never.
Look forward to the docks!!!
Sounds like a beef processing plant ! lol The Nissan of the north , lol give ma a break .:biggrinQuote:
Originally Posted by doggone
what kind of docks and where (at butla)please. thanksQuote:
Originally Posted by Gotucker
We're always the the last to know.
How many know that water is pumped from Enid lake to Batesville to supply that power plant?
Water is pumped from Horn Lake creek to the power plant north of Stateline rd?
I-55 and Church rd interchange will be rebuilt?
I-55 and Starlanding will have a new interchange?