Floating Sein net on KY

Can anybody tell me anything about these? Ran 6 crankbaits into one on KY lake this weekend, and discovered a 80 yard long net by 10' deep hanging off 6-7 jugs. The net was made up of a high lb fishing line that had approximately 4" x 4" holes in it. I thought the jugs were normal catfish just or I would have avoided it all together. The jugs were labeled and had a name and phone number. It looked like there was 3 or 4 sets of these. Does anybody know what these are for or if they are even legal?

Sounds like a gill net. :mad:

I would contact KY F&W with the name and address that was on the nets. They can tell you if there are Asian carp nets allowed in the lake at this time. I don't think there would be any other reason for those to legally be in the lake right now.

What you found is illegal. Sport fisherman are allowed to use Dip Nets and Cast Nets but not floating nets, and commercial fisherman must follow KAR 1:155 which states:
Note - I highlighted some in RED

Section 4. Tagging and Using Commercial Gear. A commercial fisherman shall:
(1) Tag commercial fishing gear pursuant to 301 KAR 1:146;
(2) Not use commercial fishing gear within:
(a)1. Fifty (50) yards of the outlet or inlet of an overflow lake; or
2. Fifty (50) yards of the mouth of a stream except the mouth of the Ohio River; and
(b) 200 yards of a dam, as established in KRS 150.445;
(3) Not use commercial nets from April 1 through October 31:
(a) In bays and inlets of Kentucky or Barkley Lakes; or
(b) Within a distance of 200 yards from the mouth of bays or inlets in Kentucky or Barkley Lakes; and
(4) Call the department at 800-858-1549 within twenty-four (24) hours if any commercial gear is:
(a) Lost;
(b) Stolen; or
(c) Irretrievable due to unforeseen circumstances.

And KAR 1:146 which states in part:

Section 1. Definitions.
(2) "Commercial gear tag" means a metal tag provided by the department that is attached to legal commercial fishing gear as established in this administrative regulation.

So what you found was not tagged with the proper Commercial Gear Tag and it is between the dates specified, making it illegal.
There may be some exemptions for the Asian Carp fisherman, but I could not find it.

I don't cross a jug line anytime just in case when pulling, I do cross em on plane but that may bite me one day. I try and parallel any line I see, there's a reason it is there and running along beside them usually produces some fesh.

Were you in Ky Waters or TN. Waters?

The Dept. Of Fish and Wildlife has allowed certain commercial fishermen to fish gill and trammel nets in KY and Barkley lakes outside of the normal commercial harvest season, with the stipulation they are fishing for silver carp. We spot check them to make sure they are complying. They are allowed to fish their nets close to the surface, however the nets must be marked with enough jugs that a boat can avoid the next. Additionally the commercial angler must remain within sight of the net.

Sounds like the net was marked, but the anler was not near by.

What day were you fishing and where was the net. With that info, I can look up the angle registered to fish there, and can warn the commercial angler to comply or get a ticket.

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Originally Posted by prister

The Dept. Of Fish and Wildlife has allowed certain commercial fishermen to fish gill and trammel nets in KY and Barkley lakes outside of the normal commercial harvest season, with the stipulation they are fishing for silver carp. We spot check them to make sure they are complying. They are allowed to fish their nets close to the surface, however the nets must be marked with enough jugs that a boat can avoid the next. Additionally the commercial angler must remain within sight of the net.

Sounds like the net was marked, but the anler was not near by.

What day were you fishing and where was the net. With that info, I can look up the angle registered to fish there, and can warn the commercial angler to comply or get a ticket.

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Paul, thanks for weighing in on this.

Thanks, Paul ... we really do appreciate your input & expertise in these matters. And we very much appreciate you being a member of Crappie.com !!

... cp :kewl

I can provide some info. My name is Michael Flinn and I am a professor at Murray State in the Biology Dept. You can reach me by phone at 270 809 6051 or email me at mflinn(at)murraystate.edu. These are experimental gill nets that are part of an Asian carp study that has been going on at Murray State Univ. for the last year or so. We are netting Asian Carp in several areas of the lake mostly between Ledbetter and Blood River. We are examining their gut contents and determining diet selectivity with the phytoplankton in the lake and the samples collected and Hancock Biological Station on their bi-weekly cruises.

We have been experimenting with the best way to mark these nets. In the winter we didn't have many problems with boaters/fisherman as we were setting the nets relatively deep. Now that the carp have moved up shallow we are having to run them shallow. All of our nets are marked with jugs that say HBS in large letters (Hancock Biological Station) and should have a phone number on at least one jug. We also have a net tag (metal and engraved) on at least one end of the net with name and phone number.

I appreciate the fact that we just can't go setting nets however/wherever we like. The reality is that the last thing we want is to lose a net or have someone cut it up. We have a ton of money invested in the nets. My grad student walked into my office this morning and told me that one of the nets was cut in half and floating on the surface when he got to it Sunday morning. During the summer we tried to avoid weekends in hopes of decreasing possible run-ins with boaters, but now that my students are in class they mostly run nets on the weekends. They typically set them out just before sunset, run them at first light, leave them soak Saturday, run them at sunset, and then run them at first light on Sunday.

We do have research collecting permits and are not bound by the commercial fishing rules. That said, I understand that most anglers/boaters likely expect that if they see a line of jugs they are expecting a net or line that is several feet under the water. Many of our nets are 12 feet tall (deep) and several hundred feet long. When we set the nets in shallow water we typically tie them in the shallow areas so they are compressed in hopes of keeping them out of any props. We have been marking all nets with jugs that have reflective tape on them and have discussed marking the ends with larger buoys that have a tall flag on them (in hopes of increasing visibility).

I expect that with future research on the lake and much of it dealing with asian carp this type of net will become much more common. They are pretty much worthless for anything but carp as they have 5" bar at the smallest opening. We catch a few big catfish as bycatch and few buffalo, grass carp and a few gar that are likely picking at the fish in the net, but that is about it.

I'd be happy to discuss any ideas you have about ways to increase their visibility for boaters etc. I'll discuss ideas with Paul Rister as well.

Again, sorry about the cranks. I spend a lot of time on the lake (fishing for fun and research) and am just trying to figure out what these carp are going to do to the ecology of the lake.

Mr Flinn ... :welcome to Crappie.com

Thank you for the clarification concerning the nets. This will, at least, give the members a reason to work with you in your research ... as I'm sure the control or eradication of this invasive species is a far greater factor than the inconvenience your nets may create.

... cp :kewl

Thanks CrappiePappy! I too would love to see the Asian Carp eradicated. It might be wishful thinking, but in the meantime we are trying to collect data that is needed to answer some of the basic questions. -What exactly are they eating? How much? When? etc. We are trying to start up some research to get an estimate of the numbers of fish in the lake. With these two estimates, we can start to answer some of the questions that concern the fishery.

Stay tuned.

Great info, making me think twice about running between jugs when on plane down here but so far in our COE lakes this is not a problem. A suggestion might be to mark the shallow nets with RED jugs from one end to the other and post a few signs at boat ramps to what they are. I know it sounds like a pain but it might save a net or two. I will not cut a net or line that is marked properly, the damage I would do is far more than what a bait would cost me. Now a line or net that is not marked is fair game and will not be a problem for the next fisherman.

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Originally Posted by h20bugz

I can provide some info. My name is Michael Flinn and I am a professor at Murray State in the Biology Dept. You can reach me by phone at 270 809 6051 or email me at mflinn(at)murraystate.edu. These are experimental gill nets that are part of an Asian carp study that has been going on at Murray State Univ. for the last year or so. We are netting Asian Carp in several areas of the lake mostly between Ledbetter and Blood River. We are examining their gut contents and determining diet selectivity with the phytoplankton in the lake and the samples collected and Hancock Biological Station on their bi-weekly cruises.

We have been experimenting with the best way to mark these nets. In the winter we didn't have many problems with boaters/fisherman as we were setting the nets relatively deep. Now that the carp have moved up shallow we are having to run them shallow. All of our nets are marked with jugs that say HBS in large letters (Hancock Biological Station) and should have a phone number on at least one jug. We also have a net tag (metal and engraved) on at least one end of the net with name and phone number.

I appreciate the fact that we just can't go setting nets however/wherever we like. The reality is that the last thing we want is to lose a net or have someone cut it up. We have a ton of money invested in the nets. My grad student walked into my office this morning and told me that one of the nets was cut in half and floating on the surface when he got to it Sunday morning. During the summer we tried to avoid weekends in hopes of decreasing possible run-ins with boaters, but now that my students are in class they mostly run nets on the weekends. They typically set them out just before sunset, run them at first light, leave them soak Saturday, run them at sunset, and then run them at first light on Sunday.

We do have research collecting permits and are not bound by the commercial fishing rules. That said, I understand that most anglers/boaters likely expect that if they see a line of jugs they are expecting a net or line that is several feet under the water. Many of our nets are 12 feet tall (deep) and several hundred feet long. When we set the nets in shallow water we typically tie them in the shallow areas so they are compressed in hopes of keeping them out of any props. We have been marking all nets with jugs that have reflective tape on them and have discussed marking the ends with larger buoys that have a tall flag on them (in hopes of increasing visibility).

I expect that with future research on the lake and much of it dealing with asian carp this type of net will become much more common. They are pretty much worthless for anything but carp as they have 5" bar at the smallest opening. We catch a few big catfish as bycatch and few buffalo, grass carp and a few gar that are likely picking at the fish in the net, but that is about it.

I'd be happy to discuss any ideas you have about ways to increase their visibility for boaters etc. I'll discuss ideas with Paul Rister as well.

Again, sorry about the cranks. I spend a lot of time on the lake (fishing for fun and research) and am just trying to figure out what these carp are going to do to the ecology of the lake.

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Michael, Thanks for the hard work you folks are doing to try to lessen the effects that the Asian carp have on our great fishery, I have seen you guys setting then running the nets in Anderson during the early spring, Any thing that can be done to eliminate the Asians is a good thing.

Let me throw this out first, I will not cut a net or trotline if it is properly marked and has the appearance of being recently placed. One that is all tangled up and covered with trash that has most certainly been in the lake for quite some time is a different story, I troll crankbaits and longline with jigs and have lost lots of $$ worth of baits to trotlines but I respect that fisherman's right to put that line out as much as my right to fish that area, That said, I would be interested in buying any crankbaits you guys bring up in your nets, all in the name of helping support science of course.

Welcome to this forum and please feel free to participate in any discussions here. We are always having questions about game laws and the biology of fishing and feel that many here have a lot to contribute to the discussion. Paul Rister has been extremely helpful in that respect for quite some time.

I will invite you and your staff to our fall KY Lake Crappie.com get together at Lakeside Campground. We would love to meet you folks and discuss the work you are doing.

Pappy, can we link this thread to the main page so others in areas affected by the Asians can see what hard work is currently being done on KY Lake to lessen the damage these fish are doing?

h2obugz, if you guys run out of Asians in the areas south of Eggners Ferry Bridge, check out the shallow flats between Jonathan and Big Bear along the secondary channel. There are times in the late afternoon that it looks like you could walk for hundreds of yards on top of the schools of huge Bighead carp. I don't see as many silvers there as in some other areas.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by h20bugz

I can provide some info. My name is Michael Flinn and I am a professor at Murray State in the Biology Dept. You can reach me by phone at 270 809 6051 or email me at mflinn(at)murraystate.edu. These are experimental gill nets that are part of an Asian carp study that has been going on at Murray State Univ. for the last year or so. We are netting Asian Carp in several areas of the lake mostly between Ledbetter and Blood River. We are examining their gut contents and determining diet selectivity with the phytoplankton in the lake and the samples collected and Hancock Biological Station on their bi-weekly cruises.

We have been experimenting with the best way to mark these nets. In the winter we didn't have many problems with boaters/fisherman as we were setting the nets relatively deep. Now that the carp have moved up shallow we are having to run them shallow. All of our nets are marked with jugs that say HBS in large letters (Hancock Biological Station) and should have a phone number on at least one jug. We also have a net tag (metal and engraved) on at least one end of the net with name and phone number.

I appreciate the fact that we just can't go setting nets however/wherever we like. The reality is that the last thing we want is to lose a net or have someone cut it up. We have a ton of money invested in the nets. My grad student walked into my office this morning and told me that one of the nets was cut in half and floating on the surface when he got to it Sunday morning. During the summer we tried to avoid weekends in hopes of decreasing possible run-ins with boaters, but now that my students are in class they mostly run nets on the weekends. They typically set them out just before sunset, run them at first light, leave them soak Saturday, run them at sunset, and then run them at first light on Sunday.

We do have research collecting permits and are not bound by the commercial fishing rules. That said, I understand that most anglers/boaters likely expect that if they see a line of jugs they are expecting a net or line that is several feet under the water. Many of our nets are 12 feet tall (deep) and several hundred feet long. When we set the nets in shallow water we typically tie them in the shallow areas so they are compressed in hopes of keeping them out of any props. We have been marking all nets with jugs that have reflective tape on them and have discussed marking the ends with larger buoys that have a tall flag on them (in hopes of increasing visibility).

I expect that with future research on the lake and much of it dealing with asian carp this type of net will become much more common. They are pretty much worthless for anything but carp as they have 5" bar at the smallest opening. We catch a few big catfish as bycatch and few buffalo, grass carp and a few gar that are likely picking at the fish in the net, but that is about it.

I'd be happy to discuss any ideas you have about ways to increase their visibility for boaters etc. I'll discuss ideas with Paul Rister as well.

Again, sorry about the cranks. I spend a lot of time on the lake (fishing for fun and research) and am just trying to figure out what these carp are going to do to the ecology of the lake.

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Might be a good idea to get with some of the local News Papers and have an article in their sporting section. Might wanna also get with some local TV stations and see if they would run a spot on this. Might help get the word out about the research.

The more awareness the less nets you'll have vandalized.

Not many crappie fishermen out there fight now but a ton of pleasure boaters and Bass Fishermen.

Just food for thought. Might wanna think about pull'n your nets with the Labor Day weekend coming up.

h20bugz
Thanks for your help. If there is anything we crappie guys can do to help you let us know.
You could get ahold of mrdux about any time he is a local crappie fisherman and on the lake a lot. He also personally knows most of the people on this page.
We need to make this noted at crappie came guys and let everyone we know to be aware of the jugs.
h20bugz we are having a crappie came October the 10-11 Could you have time to come out and tell us a little about what you are doing and what you have found so far? If so Wiskers can get that arranged for you.
Maybe bring some of your students. There is a crappie dinner in it for you!!
We could work together to see what we can do to help avoid your nets and help you any way we can.
I sure don't want something to happen were you could lose more nets you need as many as you can get.

I've been spreading the word about this post on Facebook with some fishing groups I'm in. Hope the word gets out about the nets so problems can be avoided.

Good ideas about the nets and thanks for spreading the word. We will definitely avoid running any nets over this coming weekend. I know it'll be a zoo out there.

We had debated posting some signs at some of the ramps. I'll talk to Paul Rister about this.

Also, thanks for the invite. I am always up for a crappie fry and of course my students never miss a free meal. I'll see if I can round up a few students. Either way, would be happy to share what we have been finding and share our results.

Mr. Flinn,

Sorry to hear about your net, I was on KY waters however don't know if it was the one I ran into. I am glad this has raised awareness all around concerning these nets. In the future I will try to avoid these areas, however I believe they can be marked better and maybe have a larger red buoy with some kinda marking on it. Anyways, hope your research goes well.

Thanks for all the info. Thanks Paul for all you do for us. Can't wait till crappie camp to meet Professor Flinn. I like the idea of using large red buoys with some advertisement. Why use gill nets?? I think a trawler with the right size net you could harvest all you want!

This thread (up to this point) has been copied over to the Main Message Forum.

... cp :kewl

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ifish

Thanks for all the info. Thanks Paul for all you do for us. Can't wait till crappie camp to meet Professor Flinn. I like the idea of using large red buoys with some advertisement. Why use gill nets?? I think a trawler with the right size net you could harvest all you want!

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I don't believe "RED" would be the color to use. Red is used in navigation and if it caused someone to mess up there might be some liability involved. I don't think the USCG would go for it either.

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Originally Posted by Wiskers

I don't believe "RED" would be the color to use. Red is used in navigation and if it caused someone to mess up there might be some liability involved. I don't think the USCG would go for it either.

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You're right, Terry .... probably ought to spray paint'em CHARTREUSE !! They'd be a whole lot easier to see, too :ThumbsUp

... cp :kewl

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wiskers

I don't believe "RED" would be the color to use. Red is used in navigation and if it caused someone to mess up there might be some liability involved. I don't think the USCG would go for it either.

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Neither RED or GREEN would be good colors as both are used as channel markers. Not trying to nose in Whiskers but aren't they?

Paint them flo pink. pink is picked up by the human eye very quick and for a good distance

Cautionary Buoys
◦they mark an area where mariners are to be warned of dangers such as firing ranges, racing courses, seaplane bases, underwater structures or areas where no safe through channel exists and of traffic separations.
◦they are coloured yellow
◦they display identification letters
◦if it carries a top mark it shall be a single yellow ‘X’ shape
◦if it carries a light, the light shall be yellow and flash once every 4 seconds
Attachment 172092

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Originally Posted by slabseeker1

Neither RED or GREEN would be good colors as both are used as channel markers. Not trying to nose in Whiskers but aren't they?

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YEP!