My take on the TWRA - Ky Lake meeting

Okay, this is my take on the meeting. I took a lot of notes and was writing feverishly trying to keep up with the slides on the screen. The speakers and guests were Tim Broadbent, Bobby Wilson, Alan Peterson, Bill Cox and a lady whose name I can't remember, sorry. There were 100 or so people there. The folks from TWRA made it very clear that they were there to try to educate, inform and answer questions. They're still collecting data and will be presenting recommendations to the commission at the end of August. There will be an opportunity for public comment and input for 30 days or more and then there will be a vote at the end of October for the 2015 regs.

Mr. Broadbent provided a lot of information and statistics. He also presented comparisons between Kentucky & Tennessee and Mississippi & Tennessee. Here's what I managed to get written down:

Water temp this winter was the coldest in 20 years.

Reducing the creel limit to 15 or 20 would not impact the population more than 15%.

Only 18% of anglers harvested more than 20 fish per trip from 2001 through 2012.

Angler pressure averages 5-6 hours per acre.

Increasing the minimum length to 11 or 12 inches would decrease the harvest by 43% (for 11") and 72% (for 12")

At age 2+ (fall of their 2nd year) the average crappie length is:

Ky Lake = 9.6"
Arkabutla & Sardis = 12.5"+
Grenada = 11.6"

Kentucky has been stocking 50,000 to 300,000 crappie annually in Blood River and this has not resulted in a higher catch rate.

In Kentucky, 96% of anglers harvested less than 10 fish per trip in 2011.

In Tennessee 58% of anglers harvested less than 10 fish per trip in 2011.

This was interesting: in 2005 and 2006 over 80% of surveyed anglers were not spider rigging.

If I understood him correctly, 2010 was the last good year for the "recruitment" class. The last 3 years have not been good, which has resulted a reduction in the crappie population.

He also said that this was the strangest fishing season that he's seen.

While crappie aren't doing so hot right now, the bass population is doing very well. Previous drought conditions have negatively affected the crappie and sauger populations. I don't remember the time period, but I believe he said that there was a 60% mortality rate for sauger.

As far as the Asian carp are concerned, Mr. Broadbent said that the population is not dense enough at this point to adversely affect the population but that could change in the future. Also the silver carp (those are the "flying" ones) are all the way to Pickwick but they have not documented any reproduction.

Now, here are my personal observations: It just amazes me that men who are life long, single pole fisherman think that if you put out 4 or 6 or 8 poles, you'll catch fish on EVERY pole constantly and therefore reduce the population. How ridiculous! The creel limit is the same no matter how many poles you fish with! This fact was also pointed out by the TWRA biologist. There were some complaints about people who catch a limit, go in then go back out and catch another limit repeatedly. As the officer said, if you see it happening, get a boat number and call us. They're not "fish" wardens only and they can't be everywhere at once. I look at it this way -- if I see my neighbor's house being robbed, I'm gonna call 911 instead of waiting for an office to possibly drive by and notice. So, if I see somebody "robbing" by taking more than the legal limit or keeping undersized fish, I should call TWRA. If people want to gripe about it, then they ought to be willing to do something about it, too.

Thanks for the update.

Thank you Vonna for the report could not be there but appreciate your interpretations on the meeting. Agree on the number of poles and double catches but don't think that happened much this year.
wife and I talked with Cane Pole last weekend, wonderful man...now if I can only find some connectors for my powerdrive to get a box made for the foot control conversion.
Again thanks for the information. will have to wait to see what the commission does in OCT to see how its affects us all once again.

i always kidded my buddies and said 25 per cent of the fishermen catch 75 percent of the fish

I would be curious to see the data if they raised the harvest data in 2011 from 10 fish per trip to 15 or even 20. I wonder what the percentages would be then

Appreciate the good report Vonna!! Question for you. When it was reported that if the length limit would reduce catches by 43% and 72%, was that for the 1st year after the increase in size limit or was that for every year after. If it is for 1 or 2 years, I would be all for that, as there would be more fish over 10" to lay eggs. Surely after a year or 2 the fish you can harvest would be larger and the numbers would go back to the previous numbers, as the fish should be there and you would think even more so, if the number of fish laying eggs increases.

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Originally Posted by sls

Appreciate the good report Vonna!! Question for you. When it was reported that if the length limit would reduce catches by 43% and 72%, was that for the 1st year after the increase in size limit or was that for every year after. If it is for 1 or 2 years, I would be all for that, as there would be more fish over 10" to lay eggs. Surely after a year or 2 the fish you can harvest would be larger and the numbers would go back to the previous numbers, as the fish should be there and you would think even more so, if the number of fish laying eggs increases.

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This is nothing but an opinion but when they went up to the 12 in limit on the big 4 down here the sky was falling everywhere. We were never going to be able to catch a limit of keeper's and every other thing that could go wrong. I have no data to back this up but I venture to guess more people catch good bunches of big fish today that they never caught when we had the 10 in limit. But we have lakes that are nutrient rich and forage is thick which helps to grow the fish faster and larger. I always give the experts the benefit of the doubt but I don't see how raising the length limit could hurt in the long run. You have to also realize that tourism dollars pack a lot of political impact on the board that ultimately will make the decisions. If John Henry owns a restaurant that depends on fishing tourism he is going to be against anything he perceives could hurt his business no mater what the long term impact might be.

First I'd like to thank Mrs Crappie stalker for going and being our eye's and ears. My take is that a limit is a limit. don't matter if your using one pole or 10. If I'm using 10 and catch mine in 1 hr and someone else is using 1 pole and it takes them 3 hrs good for them and me it's still a limit. Now something that hasn't been brought up and I have seen with my on eyes is the gill net folks. These should be banned and kill an enormous amount of crappie and tear up boat motors as well. If these guys want to see numbers increase lets get together with them and toot this horn. I'm told their catch goes to the Russians anyway so pee on them. Always amazes me that these biologists do the testing, have the numbers,and are educated to be where they are and know what their doing and some folks want to argue with them. That same guy that has the multiple rods catches his limit and comes back to do it again might be one. Two coves over there might be 2 brothers fishing with one pole and have over a hundred crappie caught and stashed like our TWRA guys caught last year so the POLES don't hold water.

I guess some could say I don't have a dog in this race being from KY but we do share lots of common waters so what goes on in either state affects both states. I know in our area enforcement is key to whatever laws are currently in place or that might change. We get tons of visitors/tourists to our area and most are lawful in their pursuits. Some are not.

Many think game laws pertain to everybody but themselves and those 8 inch crappie eat as good as a 12 inches so since I'm spending all this $$ for license and such, I'm keeping whatever I want until somebody stops me. I have had friends almost come to blows with such people at cleaning stations who were cleaning 5 gallon buckets full of 7-8 inch crappie and resented to the point of violence somebody saying something about it. Until the state F&W have the funding to put more enforcement people on the water and around the lakes, this mindset is not going to change. Until WE are willing to do something about the good-ol-boy mentality of many of our neighbors, all the new laws out there are not going to make a difference. I recently put a post on the main forum about seeing a guy catch some undersized crappie on KY lake and drop them in the livewell. Granted, I should have called my local CO right then and there. I keep his # in my phone. I got blasted by some here that it was none of my business. I decided then that the next time I see a willful violation of our game laws, I'm going to call. I'M GOING TO MAKE IT MY BUSINESS!!

The folks who are whining about pole limits are just doing so out of jealousy. It seems those folks may have an ally who has a big bully pulpit. I don't understand that at all. A limit is a limit.

Ive fished the Mid Section of Ky Lake,Eva Tn area my whole life since the 70's.I spider rig,tight line and slip float the stakes when the spawn hits.This past spawn I have never seen the fishing pressure like it was this year.You had to wait to even fish a stake mat.I ended up going north and south to get away from everyone.My numbers were down this year but the size was up.I do believe that Crappie numbers are a bit down also.The kicker is what Stalker said about the bass populations being up.These bass eat anything that swims by especially small crappie.Bass tourneys these days are taking 25 to 30 pounds on 5 fish to win now and it hasnt been that way but the last few years with exception of 1990's eariler.My take is that fishing pressure is up and the Bass are eating a lot of the Crappie Fry.Most of my Crappie fishing friends numbers were down also this year.

plenty fish i cranked a limit up this morning,first time ive been on the lake all year.alot of the people that gripe about spiderrigging is the guy that fishes the spawn with a minnow and a float and never fishes again all year,have a couple where i work.if u have a year like this where the weather isnt stable it makes it hard for them to catch fish and they gripe more about pole limits,this is just where i work,lol

I like the statement a limit is a limit. Crappie fishing was off this year for me but I think it was the weather. Lots of wind this spring and a very cold winter. My numbers weren't as great as years past but the size of my fish was up and I was still getting limits. I think the 10 inch size limit and 20 keeper limit should stay the same. Just my opinion.

The biologist said that's generally what they see, when the crappie are good, the bass aren't so good and vice versa. Crappie and sauger don't do well in drought conditions while bass are not as adversely affected. Also, you have to consider that no matter what regulations are passed, 1) you can't control nature and 2) the TWRA can't control the TVA. Of course, we all know that the TVA could care less about what's good or bad for fishermen, because while they have control over lake levels, the fish and the fishermen are not their concern.

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Originally Posted by Mrs. Crappie Stalker

The biologist said that's generally what they see, when the crappie are good, the bass aren't so good and vice versa. Crappie and sauger don't do well in drought conditions while bass are not as adversely affected. Also, you have to consider that no matter what regulations are passed, 1) you can't control nature and 2) the TWRA can't control the TVA. Of course, we all know that the TVA could care less about what's good or bad for fishermen, because while they have control over lake levels, the fish and the fishermen are not their concern.

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Yep, one year of them yanking the plug out of the lake when the spawn is taking place in high water will wipe out an entire year class of crappie. That is more damaging than all the pole limits, creel limits or size limits could ever make up for. TVA will tell you, these lake are for flood control and they could care less about fishermen. One thing I'd be willing to bet they listen to is the high rollers who have the ears of the politicians.

Thanks for your input Vonna.