597 ci HELP

Just want to say thanks to everyone for all the input and info you have shared with me over the last week. I went last night to Cabelas to purchase a Lowrance Elite5 DS with GPS. Ended up getting the HB 597ci HD DI combo for $599. It was practically a coin toss between the two. The HB was $50 cheaper but that was not totally the deciding factor. Actually had a pretty knowledgeable sales rep that showed me the all the fun stuff. I liked the Elite 5 for the fact you can scroll back and mark a way point. That was one of my main reasons for wanting it. It doesn't appear that you can do that on the HB. At least not any further back than whats on the screen at the present time. Maybe Im wrong on that. I did like the fact that on the HB you could have the 2d and downscan on the screen at the same time. Elite doesn't have the 2D at all. It appeared that the HB was a bit sharper and brighter. At least in the simulation modes. Who knows what the real world screens will be.
Again thanks for sharing your experiences and helpful tips. I may be asking one or two (hundred) more questions of you guys/gals as I attempt to learn my new toy.
Ok one question right away. do you think it would work fine to mount the transducer on the bottom of my jackplate? That would move it back form the transom about 6-8 inches but im not wanting to drill any more holes in the boat. Would the 2d cone possibly see skag on the motor? Im thinking the cone wouldn't be wide enough at that depth to see it.

Ok another question already. Upon registering my depth finder the first thing I find out is it needs an update. Now before I even get it mounted it appears I need to purchase a SD card and a card reader. I couldn't find anything stating how big of capacity card the finder will work with. Does anyone have any recommendations on cards and readers? I have a Best Buy just a few minutes from me.
I know in order to record or take snap shots I need a card. How long can you record on a 2 gig or a 8 gig card? When you play back a recording can you add a way point to it at that time. Say I play it back and find a stump I went over 3 hours ago. Can I add a way point now?

Conguations on your new unit,what ever name brand you have decided on on im sure you will be pleased.you see alot of people with side scan transducers mounted on the jack,so i suppose it should work.i did have my 997 nounted there.it did work but i had lines up hlgh in the water column on the left side so i moved it.when your boats on plane the transducer will be out of the water thou.i use a 2gig sandisk , holds way more than i will ever nead.i dont no the size limmit of sd card but i have heard people using 16gig.thats for power users.theres proberly no limmit .you can mark waypionts 20 years from now using the recordings that you have saved.just play back a recording in your 597 when ever you want.move your curser over a spot that you want to mark push the mark button.you can save all your navigation info if you want.

Congrats on the purchase. I was wondering if the Elite had d2 and you answered my ?. On the SD card, make sure you get the right one, some units require a MICRO SD card, others just the "regular" size. 2gig will hold quite a few snapshots, and some video, but may as well get the 8gig if price is reasonable. You could always buy a 2 or 3 2gig cards if it works out, 1 for video, 1 for pics, hope you enjoy.

Poll - What size SD Card do you use? this person says that you can use a 32gig.thats a hole lot

Good. Thanks again guys. I bought a reader and an 4 gb sandisk today. Once I download the update and install it on the unit is it ok to use the disk to make recordings? Should I delete the update on the disk after the install?

Ifs up to you if you want to leave the update on the card.if you do leave everytime you turn on a window will pop showing the update version.P.S. be sure to close the drive on your computer before removing sd card

Not that it matters to C&S, now that he's purchased the HB unit .... but (for me & anyone else with a Elite 5DSI):

The statement about the Elite 5DSI not having 2D capabilities :confused: ..... I'm confused. I have a E5DSI ... and I have the emulator downloaded on my computer. If I go to the Menu, then Sonar ... & put it on "Greyscale" (with or without "Fish ID" turned on), then I get what I consider a 2D sonar return. It looks very much like the picture I get on any other regular DF unit, & actually a better overall picture. With Fish ID on ... I get a good bottom pic, and the fish symbols & depth readings of each fish --- with Fish ID off, I get the same bottom pic & the fish are pictured as arches. Isn't that 2D ??
Now ... I will have to say that I've only done this on the emulator program, as I've only had my unit "on the water" one time, and I was more involved in fishing than I was in running thru the unit's menu & trying out the different settings. Still trying to pinpoint exactly where I want to permanently mount the unit, so that it's viewable but well out of the way of the TM cables.

Anyway ... I was just curious as to what's NOT 2D about this unit. Not trying to compare it against any other particular unit, but just trying to understand this new (to me) technology & the jargon/terminology associated with it. Also wanted clarification for any other member that has this unit, or may be considering purchasing it ... so that all of its can & can't do's are put out in the open, so that members can make a more informed choice.

... cp :cool:

CP , you need to go to the lake and play with that darn thing more, and give a full review of it. I'm looking at this unit myself, and wish you would speed things along for me. come on, help a guy out some. JK, I know life gets in the way. I've got a new Terrova leaning up again the boat now, and not had time to get it ON the boat.

yall got me confused on all this.whats 2d and if di not 2d then what is it, cause it sure aint 3d.hmmmm maybe it is and i just didnt get the glasses to go with it

Quote:

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Originally Posted by crappie&shrooms

Good. Thanks again guys. I bought a reader and an 4 gb sandisk today. Once I download the update and install it on the unit is it ok to use the disk to make recordings? Should I delete the update on the disk after the install?

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HB recommends the Sandisk Extreme III SD cards.... I use the 20mbps but will soon be getting the 30mbps...

Mbps is the data transfer rate from the processor writing to the card. ...the faster the transfer rate, the less "lag time" there will be from the time you hit "mark waypoint" to the time the unit writes that data to the card and returns the unit to "live" view...

Faster transfer rates also allow recordings to written more smoothly without jumps, skips, lags, in the recording...

Transfer rate will have little effect on software updates because those files are not as large as GPS data...

Rickie

Trust me, no one gets anymore confused than I do. I may be totally wrong in my conclusions on both of these units. Sorry if I have led anyone astray.
At the store with both units on and practically side by side I played with both units. I didn't have clue what I was doing. BUT I could only get one sonar screen on the Elite 5 ds. That was a downscan view. That could be combined with the map or gps screen but I could find no traditional sonar screen. The sales rep told me that unit only has down scan. There was basically 4 different views you could use. Sonar screen, sonar and navigational split, navigational only, and one other that I can't remember what it was but I think it was some sort of mapping screen. Now there could be that some of the screens were turned off and we couldn't find them.
On the HB there were 6 different views I think.

Thanks Rnvinc. (I think)!
Looks like before I open up the package on this card I would be better off to return it and get the suggested one. Keep all the info coming. I plan on installing this tomorrow.

What is the difference in an SD and a SDHC card. About all I can find is the SDHC

The biggest difference in different sonar technologies (2d, DI, SI) is the shape of the sonar beam that affects where in the water column that return came from that you see on your screen...

2d is a cone emanating from Xducer in a downward direction...

DI & SI are a thin slice emanating down and out to the sides 90 degrees from the Xducer...

So , CP, to answer your question....although your image may look similar to 2d image... Where that structure actually is under your boat depends on which shape beam you are sending thru the water...

If you are using 2d... Then that structure is in that cone shaped beam alwost directly under the Xducer...

If you are using DI... then that structure is in that thin sliced beam "somewhere"...

If you are using SI... that the unit will show you which side of the boat that structure is on...

Clear as mud yet...??

Rickie

Quote:

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Originally Posted by crappie&shrooms

What is the difference in an SD and a SDHC card. About all I can find is the SDHC

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SD only comes up to 2 gig (I think)...

SDHC is "high capacity" that comes up to 32 gig...

I keep 5 separate cards with my unit at all times...

1 with current version of software installed...
1 with previous version of software in case I need to revert to a previous version to get rid of a bug...
1 with all my backed up wp"s on it in case a bug erases my GPS data(never happened so far)...
1 with saved recordings from previous trips for referral...
1 blank for today's fishing trip....

SD cards are very reasonable in price... There is no need to try and stuff everything onto 1...

On a different topic.... Keep your recordings to 30 minutes or less....transferrin all that data into a viewer such as Humviewer takes a LONG time if you record much longer than this...

Rickie

Nice tip. Never thought of that.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rnvinc

SD only comes up to 2 gig (I think)...

SDHC is "high capacity" that comes up to 32 gig...

I keep 5 separate cards with my unit at all times...

1 with current version of software installed...
1 with previous version of software in case I need to revert to a previous version to get rid of a bug...
1 with all my backed up wp"s on it in case a bug erases my GPS data(never happened so far)...
1 with saved recordings from previous trips for referral...
1 blank for today's fishing trip....

SD cards are very reasonable in price... There is no need to try and stuff everything onto 1...

On a different topic.... Keep your recordings to 30 minutes or less....transferrin all that data into a viewer such as Humviewer takes a LONG time if you record much longer than this...

Rickie

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by crappie&shrooms

Trust me, no one gets anymore confused than I do. I may be totally wrong in my conclusions on both of these units. Sorry if I have led anyone astray.
At the store with both units on and practically side by side I played with both units. I didn't have clue what I was doing. BUT I could only get one sonar screen on the Elite 5 ds. That was a downscan view. That could be combined with the map or gps screen but I could find no traditional sonar screen. The sales rep told me that unit only has down scan. There was basically 4 different views you could use. Sonar screen, sonar and navigational split, navigational only, and one other that I can't remember what it was but I think it was some sort of mapping screen. Now there could be that some of the screens were turned off and we couldn't find them.
On the HB there were 6 different views I think.

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HB DI units have DI & 2d...

The Lowrance DI units do not have 2d...

Some guys find DI as plenty for their fishing method...
Some guys like DI & 2d....

I have to agree with Kosmo....
2d gives me better sonar info than DI...
DI makes pretty snapshots to post on forums...

Rickie

Im thinking im going to be happy with my decision. I like the fact that I can have a couple different imaging views. Hopefully by the time we get to the crappie shindig I will have a few of the bugs worked out (or more worked in). At least I am hoping there will be a few at the shindig that can show me a few pointers, or help me understand it a little better. I know I will have to get with them BEFORE THEY GET INTO THE FRUIT JARS Doh. At least that,s my understanding.

Here is info that I feel is basic understanding when trying to learn any type of new sonar technology...
http://www.crappie.com/crappie/fishi...am-shapes.html

Always remember... If it ain't in that sonar beam....it ain't gonna show on your screen...

Rickie

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rnvinc

HB recommends the Sandisk Extreme III SD cards.... I use the 20mbps but will soon be getting the 30mbps...

Mbps is the data transfer rate from the processor writing to the card. ...the faster the transfer rate, the less "lag time" there will be from the time you hit "mark waypoint" to the time the unit writes that data to the card and returns the unit to "live" view... Faster transfer rates also allow recordings to written more smoothly without jumps, skips, lags, in the recording...

Transfer rate will have little effect on software updates because those files are not as large as GPS data...

Rickie

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Just so there is no confusion...let me clarify 1 statement that I have highlighted in blue above....

The "Mark" button serves 2 purposes on the HB units...
1. To set waypoint data into the unit's internal memory (waypoints go straight into the internal memory)
2. To take a snapshot of the image that is currently showing on the screen....(snapshots go straight to the SD card)

An SD card's mbps write speed has no effect on setting GPS data into the internal memory of the unit...
The SD card's mbps write speed has a BIG effect on getting all the snapshot data onto the SD card....

So if you have your "snapshot" feature enabled on your unit...when you hit "Mark" on your unit, the faster the mbps write speed of your SD card, the faster the unit will write that snapshot data to the card and return your unit to "live view"...

Rickie

http://i826.photobucket.com/albums/z...newDIbeams.png your 597 has all of these

Well Allllllrighty then !! Now we're cookin with gas Hands Clapping

My Elite 5DSI has 455/800 kHz beams ... and that illustration tells me what I need to know (Thanks, Kosmo Thumbs Up )

The 455 kHz DI beam = 75deg elongated cone & the 800 kHz DI beam = 45deg elongated cone. That explains the "slice" reference from "rnvinc". That also goes along with the info in the "beam shapes" link, providing me with a better understanding of why the TM mounted DI transducers need to be pointing forward, when underway ... so that the picture isn't distorted, & the coverage area is right under the transducer & to both sides of the boat, simultaneously (ie - slice/elongated cone).

(note : the emulator program that I downloaded, only shows 83/200 kHz readings Doh and had me a little confused. Now that I'm more informed about the beam angles/shape, I can better determine what my unit is telling me. Thumbs Up )

Thanks guys ... you've been a big help Hands Clapping

... cp :cool:

Thanks for the diagram Kosmo....

I've always believed that if users could understand how their different beams are shaped, then they can use that info to understand what will (or will not) show on their sonar screens...

If it ain't in that sonar beam... It ain't gonna show on that screen...

Pappy... Your emulator program sounds a little confusing to me also...
If your elite doesn't have 2d (which would be the 83/200) I don't understand why Lowrance would show that info for a unit that doesn't have 2d...

Rickie

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rnvinc

Pappy... Your emulator program sounds a little confusing to me also...
If your elite doesn't have 2d (which would be the 83/200) I don't understand why Lowrance would show that info for a unit that doesn't have 2d...

Rickie

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Rick ... the emulator download is for the Elite 5 (which does have 83/200). There is no Elite 5DSI emulator listed Doh ... just for the Elite 5 & the Elite 5x.

Don't matter much to me, anyway .... now that I'm aware of the actual beams that my unit has !! I was just using it to familiarize myself with what capabilities the unit has, & which ones I'll use ... so that I'll be able to quickly dial in my needed settings, to match the conditions, and not have to spend a lot of time "testing/tweaking" (taking my eyes off my poles for any length of time).

... cp :cool:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by crappiepappy

Rick ... the emulator download is for the Elite 5 (which does have 83/200). There is no Elite 5DSI emulator listed Doh ... just for the Elite 5 & the Elite 5x.

Don't matter much to me, anyway .... now that I'm aware of the actual beams that my unit has !! I was just using it to familiarize myself with what capabilities the unit has, & which ones I'll use ... so that I'll be able to quickly dial in my needed settings, to match the conditions, and not have to spend a lot of time "testing/tweaking" (taking my eyes off my poles for any length of time).

... cp :cool:

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That does make more sense why L would show the 2d (83/200) on that emulator...

So now that it's clearer how the sonar beam is shaped, then it should be a little clearer how that beam shape creates an image on the screen....

Every time the unit pings it records that "thin slice" of water and plots that info on the screen to the far right.....(on a DI screen).....
The next ping records the next "thin slice" of water and plots that info to far right of the screen(pushing the previous ping info left)....

On and on this goes ...pinging.... recording... plotting on the screen... This sequence is what "builds" the image on the screen AND why it is important for the boat to be moving forward in a straight line...(when using DI or SI)...

If the boat were not moving... The unit would be pinging, recording, and plotting on the screen the exact same "thin slice" of water....

Rickie

Sorry for all the dumb questions but I haven't had a chance to get on the water with my new unit yet.
Before I do something stupid on the water and delete all my way points I want to confirm I am understanding this correctly.
Ok say I make a recording or take a few snap shots while trolling around. Then a little later I review the snap shots or recording and mark a few waypoints I am interested in fishing. If I then delete the recordings or snap shots will I still have my waypoints? It won't delete them will it?
Thank you all for your help and I'm truly sorry to keep asking this stuff but I won't be able to get on the water to play with it until I arrive at Ky lake the end of this week. Just trying to get as prepared as possible BEFORE I get on the water.

All waypionts are saved internally.not on the sd card.when you take a snapshat a waypiont will be stored on the unit

Thanks Kosmo. That,s what I was thinking.
When you take a snapshot and it saves a waypoint I assume it saves the waypoint at your present boat location. Which in theory is the right edge of the screen. What if what you are seeing on the snapshot (brushpile) is actually already moved to the center or left side of the screen. You can move your cursor to the brushpile and hit mark but doesn't that just save another snapshot?
Aaaaaaaa never mind. I think I just answered my own question. Before I hit mark to save snapshot it would be best to just move the cursor to the correct location. Right?

Every time you hit "Mark" the unit saves a wp to the internal memory...either at your present location or moving the cursor to mark the wp at the cursor....

The unit only saves a snapshot of the screen to the SD card "IF" you have the snapshot feature enabled in your menu selection...

Rickie

Well got on water for the first time yesterday with the new HP.
The good:
The sonar part works fine and shows good detail. I played with sever different colors and palets to see which I like the best. For the down scan I am kinda partial to the green. Seems like I got better detail on the 800 kHz. Will try the 455khz more today. On the traditional sonar it was fine on either one.
The bad:
The navigational part sucked. Every time I marked a waypoint and tried to return to it the map was jumping all over the place. At times the cursor was moving almost 180 degrees. I would zoom in to as much at 10 ft but no way could get back to waypoint. I even marked a waypoint and dropped a bouy and tried to return to it. At one time it had be off by 50-75 YARDS!. I'll play with that feature more today.
Oh crappies won today. 0 crappie, 3 gills.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by crappie&shrooms

Well got on water for the first time yesterday with the new HP.
The good:
The sonar part works fine and shows good detail. I played with sever different colors and palets to see which I like the best. For the down scan I am kinda partial to the green. Seems like I got better detail on the 800 kHz. Will try the 455khz more today. On the traditional sonar it was fine on either one.
The bad:
The navigational part sucked. Every time I marked a waypoint and tried to return to it the map was jumping all over the place. At times the cursor was moving almost 180 degrees. I would zoom in to as much at 10 ft but no way could get back to waypoint. I even marked a waypoint and dropped a bouy and tried to return to it. At one time it had be off by 50-75 YARDS!. I'll play with that feature more today.
Oh crappies won today. 0 crappie, 3 gills.

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I keep my navigation on "North Up" to keep the map from spinning around...

I also keep my "Continuous Navigation" set to "On" to keep the unit from thinking I've found the wp and looking for the next one...

I also try to mark waypoints at the point on the screen where the structure attaches to the bottom ( when marking wps with the cursor)...

Rickie

it should work really well.i have no broblem with mine.i use course up option on mine that way it always turns my screen in the direction im going.as long as your units functioning properly you should not have problems finding waypoints. ill play with mine tomorrow when i get in from work and let you no how mine does . i mainly use my big unit for waypionts. got to go ive got a lot of crappie to dress. i get back with you tomorrow.

I think I got along with it a little better today. I started out with north up but later changed to course up or track up. I don't know about the continuous navigation. I will look at that tomorrow. I didn't actually mess with trying to find waypoint today. But I did mark a lot and will try to go back to them tomorrow. We spent a couple hours just trolling around and marking waypoints. Will go back and fish some of them tomorrow.
Thanks for all your help and suggestions everybody.

i played with marking waypoints and returning to them today.it worked very well. as long as units functioning properly i dont think that you will have an problems returning to waypionts wants you get familiar with the unit. good luck and happy fishing