Thread: Ask the Biologist

X2. That was very interesting reading, for sure. Every year I scan the fishing forecast to see how my favorite lakes are rated. It was very interesting to read about what factors affected the fish populations so anglers can really understand what's going on under the water. WTG Craig!

Craig,

Thanks for all of your great advise on here. One things I know many of us on here are big about is building and placing structure in lakes we fish (with premission from the corp or lake manager where needed).

What are your opinions on placing structure in lakes.
1. What are the pros and cons for hard woods vs cedars or PVC? In KS does one work better than others. We mostly put in Cedar trees but would oak or some other hard wood work better.
2. What type of existing structure or lake feature do you look for in a lake before you place structure (for crappie). When you have so many breaks and points and coves what do you zero in on. With these new fancy GPS's, we can get fairly close to the X if we know what to look for.
3. What should we know as a do or don't before we place structure.

Thanks,

Nick

Originally Posted by Springhill Duckman

Craig,

Thanks for all of your great advise on here. One things I know many of us on here are big about is building and placing structure in lakes we fish (with premission from the corp or lake manager where needed).

What are your opinions on placing structure in lakes.
1. What are the pros and cons for hard woods vs cedars or PVC? In KS does one work better than others. We mostly put in Cedar trees but would oak or some other hard wood work better.
2. What type of existing structure or lake feature do you look for in a lake before you place structure (for crappie). When you have so many breaks and points and coves what do you zero in on. With these new fancy GPS's, we can get fairly close to the X if we know what to look for.
3. What should we know as a do or don't before we place structure.

Thanks,

Nick

Nick,

As you mentioned, first off is having permission/habitat permit from the issuing authority (COE or KDWP depending on the situation). Each lake may be different as we have lakes operated by several different entities including Corps of Engineers (both Tulsa and KC Districts of COE), Bureau of Reclamation, and numerous city and county operators.

1). Cedars are usually a good choice because at most of our reservoirs the cedars are plentiful. Cedars are easy to work and provide good habitat....for a little while. Cedars don't last very long when compared to the hardwoods such as oak or hedge. It doesn't take but 3 or 4 years for a big ol' cedar to be reduced to mainly a large main trunk with a few larger limbs coming off of it. If you place structure every year then cedars would be a good choice. If you like to have your piles last a while longer, then hardwoods are a good choice. Problems with hardwoods are THORNS on hedge can create handling difficulties and cutting oaks for fish habitat is not as well received as cutting cedars, locusts, or some other less desirable tree. I've heard numerous anglers say that a cedar won't hold fish until the leaves fall off, something about "chemicals" that "repel" fish. I have not seen this. I placed a bunch of cedars in Chase State Fishing Lake a few years ago and went back a couple days later with an Aqua-View camera and there were fish ALL OVER the cedars including bass, bluegill, and CRAPPIE!! These fish didn't seem to mind getting in the new habitat and these were fresh cut cedars (fresh cut cedars are MUCH easier to sink than ones that have laid out all year requiring much less anchor material to sink them to the bottom).

PVC is gaining popularity. It is easy to work with, designs are limitless, it is easy to fish, attractive to fish, and it lasts a long, long time. Some lakes allow PVC structures while others don't. PVC structure kits are commercially available but there are seems to a friend of a friend that has a "limitless" supply of PVC so this may be a good option.

2). Where to place structure is a VERY popular question. Where YOU want to fish is normally the deciding factor. In most lakes the fish WILL find your structure making it a more productive area. Do you want to fish the structure spring, summer, or winter?? Depth will play a big role in determining your location. I have placed shallower piles to be used during the spring months and I have also placed deeper piles that produce during the colder months. It is also good to take lake shape and wind direction in to consideration. You wouldn't want to put all your winter piles on the extreme south end of a lake where you will have no protection from prevailing northerly winter winds. Place the piles where you can fish them! After considering some of the above details, I will then begin looking for the 'spot on the spot', an area that should already be somewhat attractive to fish. Like you mention a sharp break or cut or creek channel is always good. If there is standing timber at the edge of a submerged creek channel then adding some additional cover at the bases of the existing trees at the top of the channel ledge or on the break is a good choice. Basically, find an area that looks 'fishy' already and add some additional habitat. Keep in mind how that tree will look when you drop it. Will it stand straight up? Will it lay down horizontally? By varying your anchoring technique you can create diversity in the piles.

3). One thing a lot of people don't know is that it is illegal to cut trees on wildlife areas. Just walking up on shore and cutting a tree for fish habitat is against regulations. Some lakes you may have to bring your own trees. Checking with the local fish biologists may save you a lot of headaches and you may get some local access to habitat materials. It is a good idea (required for most habitat permits that I know of) to provide the fish bio a map with locations of your intended brush. Now everyone thinks that is because the fish bio wants to go fish YOUR piles all the time but the real reason is so we know where the piles are so we don't string sampling equipment in an area that has been recently covered up with new piles (gill nets and brushpiles are NOT a good mix!!). Also the map allows your selected location to be reviewed to make sure it is an acceptable area in acceptable depths at normal pool. Do a little homework, make a few calls, and BE CAREFUL and you should have a good habitat project.

I've got to ask: what is a white perch and what is a wiper?

Originally Posted by blairarnold

I've got to ask: what is a white perch and what is a wiper?

Check out the links below on the Ks. Dept. of Wildlife & Parks website.

White perch

Wiper (or hybrid striped bass)

Craig,
When you put piles in do you record GPS coordinates? (specifically chase county. ) I know out at Glen Elder the piles and their coordinates are availabe for public to see.
Thanks,
Travis

Originally Posted by Craig Johnson

Check out the links below on the Ks. Dept. of Wildlife & Parks website.

White perch

Wiper (or hybrid striped bass)

Okay, now I now.

We call the wipers hybrids, and I thought that was what they were called elsewhere as well. I do have to say that I had never heard tell of white perch. They look like a minature white bass on the picture. Where did they come from? Are they native to somewhere in the U.S., or are they foreign, and, if foreign, how did they get loose here. We have those awful silver or asian carp here now, and Lord knows they are bad enough.

Hi Craig....Hey I'm from Wichita and go to El Dorado often to camp bought a boat not long ago and ready to start fishing for mostly crappie,bass & catfish.

How is the crappie fishing on the lake??? Is the standing timber around the Box Turtle Point campground (Bluestem) worth trying???

Also looking at the timber in the Boulder Bluff area for crappie also.

I also went catfishing in the cove behind the marina and had some luck with catfish 32 caught by 3 of us but were only able to keep 5 because of size (small).Would this be a good place to try for crappie??

I would also like to do some Bass fishing on the lake but never hear any reports or from anyone fishing for bass on El Dorado.

Thanks for reading and any help you can give.Also thanks for all the work you do on the lakes.

Signed up for a camphost job for 2011 at El Dorado Lake if I get it will be doing a lot of fishing in my free time.Been camping at the park since 2001 but have not done much fishing on it.